Major Alaskan Oil Field Shutting Down - Page 2

Concept · 08-07-2006, 05:20 PM

Originally Posted by willis

and yet, all the articles i've seen are calling for us to watch for around a 5 cent jump...

such bullshit

But when those barrels are gone, they'd have to compensate for the oil that was supposed to be stored that but that cannot arrive because of the problem.

This market is really fragile.

And people want to make every possible dollar that they can

DosEquis · 08-07-2006, 05:21 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Right because shutting in the pipeline is popular

Its not like it is going to hurt them and I suspect they don't care about what is popular. The price just goes up and they still get their money.

DosEquis · 08-07-2006, 05:22 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Oh and for the record this is costing BP 30 million a day just in oil, that isn't factoring in the costs of new pipe, labor etc...so they want to get this opened just as fast as anyone else.

Does that 30 million include adjusting it for the barrels they are still able to sell? They are making $2 more a barrel on the other stuff now after their announcement.

motivez · 08-07-2006, 05:23 PM

Because it's a lapse in real inspections that apparently caused this.

willis · 08-07-2006, 05:23 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

What? Why do you want to restirct anwr drilling? because they found a problem and fixed it before there was a major spill? Because obviously the checks in the pipeline unocvered a problem?

they didn't find a problem and fixed it. they had a pretty large spill and the govt told them to fix it.

and the reason they had a pretty large spill is because their safety checks were lacking in the first place, i would guess because it's cheaper to not do a "pigging" check routinely..

willis · 08-07-2006, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by Concept

But when those barrels are gone, they'd have to compensate for the oil that was supposed to be stored that but that cannot arrive because of the problem.

This market is really fragile.

And people want to make every possible dollar that they can

i do understand that, but i take issue with the price of gas going up because of this tomorrow when there is no real supply issue as of yet.

and also, if the price goes up because of supply disruptions, it should go back down to pre-disruption levels when the disruption is fixed..

unfortunately, it doesn't because of the second part, people wanting to make as much as possible.. which I can't argue with because it's a free country, they are free to charge whatever the market can sustain, but personally I disagree with their actions..

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 05:28 PM

Originally Posted by DosEquis

Does that 30 million include adjusting it for the barrels they are still able to sell? They are making $2 more a barrel on the other stuff now after their announcement.

They are not able to sell barrels that would normally come down that pipe. Thats what people in this thread dont seem to understand. It doesn't stop production because of the pipeline problem. Yes inventories are above average in the area, but what does that matter if they can't ship it out? Thats the whole piont of the pipeline. Production will continue they just cant move it until the pipeline reopens.

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by willis

i do understand that, but i take issue with the price of gas going up because of this tomorrow when there is no real supply issue as of yet.

and also, if the price goes up because of supply disruptions, it should go back down to pre-disruption levels when the disruption is fixed..

unfortunately, it doesn't because of the second part, people wanting to make as much as possible.. which I can't argue with because it's a free country, they are free to charge whatever the market can sustain, but personally I disagree with their actions..

thats teh whole point of commodity trading, to keep prices at a point where you DO NOT have supply problems.

Concept · 08-07-2006, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by willis

unfortunately, it doesn't because of the second part, people wanting to make as much as possible.. which I can't argue with because it's a free country, they are free to charge whatever the market can sustain, but personally I disagree with their actions..

willis · 08-07-2006, 05:35 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

thats teh whole point of commodity trading, to keep prices at a point where you DO NOT have supply problems.

if you say so..

I understand that I don't understand commodity trading, and i don't think whatever higher power there is out there meant for me to understand it because as much as I try and get it, i just get confused..

i'll stick with unintelligently bitching instead

*edit* and now I have a question..

how does the price of gas rising immediately because of this disruption keep prices at a point where there aren't supply problems??

The price of gas goes up, people bitch, but there isn't a mass movement away from gas, and the demands are still the same. the price of gas isn't effecting anything other than the profit the companies are making.. and in most places (in my experience) the neverending rise in gas won't do anything to change demand for gas.. it's not like i particularly have a choice to drive or not drive. there is no mass transit option available for me to get to work, so I have to drive or not work. how does the rising price of gas do anything to shorten my effect on the limited supply??

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by willis

if you say so..

I understand that I don't understand commodity trading, and i don't think whatever higher power there is out there meant for me to understand it because as much as I try and get it, i just get confused..

i'll stick with unintelligently bitching instead

Commodity trading has issues, I'm not a huge fan of it, but it does do a damn good job at fullfilling its intended purpose and that is regulating prices to balance supply and demand.

willis · 08-07-2006, 05:44 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Commodity trading has issues, I'm not a huge fan of it, but it does do a damn good job at fullfilling its intended purpose and that is regulating prices to balance supply and demand.

I dunno, I don't see how it effects the demand, at least on a person to person level.

i dont' like the rising gas prices, my personal budget is being hurt by them, but I have no choice. my demand for gas will remain the same regardless of the price, as I think will the majority of most peoples..

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 05:53 PM

Originally Posted by willis

I dunno, I don't see how it effects the demand, at least on a person to person level.

i dont' like the rising gas prices, my personal budget is being hurt by them, but I have no choice. my demand for gas will remain the same regardless of the price, as I think will the majority of most peoples..

Then prices will keep going up.

willis · 08-07-2006, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Then prices will keep going up.

so at what point does this system help with suppy and demand??

at the theoretical limit when people can no longer afford to get to work / do daily tasks??

dunno.. i don't see how that is a helpful system if by the time it finally affects pricing the price is too high for everyday life.

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 06:01 PM

Originally Posted by willis

so at what point does this system help with suppy and demand??

at the theoretical limit when people can no longer afford to get to work / do daily tasks??

dunno.. i don't see how that is a helpful system if by the time it finally affects pricing the price is too high for everyday life.

becuase if they can't afford it they quit buying, supply increases and prices come down...basic economics my friend.

willis · 08-07-2006, 06:05 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

becuase if they can't afford it they quit buying, supply increases and prices come down...basic economics my friend.

i understand what you're saying, but I'm saying I don't see how that will work in this situation.

if gas prices ever got high enough to really affect demand enough so that supply would increase, I think the damage to the economy / the average person would be greater than the help they would get when gas prices dropped a bit..

there's also the question of whether the gas prices would ever go back down. supply and demand says they would, but you don't seen a downturn in gas prices once oil recovers from a price spike. it stays at the price it was when oil was high..

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 06:09 PM

Originally Posted by willis

i understand what you're saying, but I'm saying I don't see how that will work in this situation.

if gas prices ever got high enough to really affect demand enough so that supply would increase, I think the damage to the economy / the average person would be greater than the help they would get when gas prices dropped a bit..

there's also the question of whether the gas prices would ever go back down. supply and demand says they would, but you don't seen a downturn in gas prices once oil recovers from a price spike. it stays at the price it was when oil was high..

Maybe it does damage the economy, but no one seemed to care when the energy companies were losing their asses in the 1990s with ridiculous low prices.

Look I agree the system is broken or we wouldn't have had a need for so many mergers in the 1990s. The fact is american's use way too much energy whent hey could be doing simple things to reduce their consumption. Things as easy as light bulb changes go undone. There's many oil fired power plants inthis country, yet people continue to waste energy not just with their inneffecient cars but with inneffecient use around the house. Americans need to change the way they use energy otherwise you're right people will be pinched in the pocket book and consumer spending on other goods will indeed drop.

motivez · 08-07-2006, 07:22 PM

As long as oil prices aren't based on supply / demand, I have a hard time feeling bad for the fact that they might not have been doing as well as they are now in the 1990's or any other decade.

6SpeedTA95 · 08-07-2006, 10:28 PM

Originally Posted by motivez

As long as oil prices aren't based on supply / demand, I have a hard time feeling bad for the fact that they might not have been doing as well as they are now in the 1990's or any other decade.

They are indirectly based on supply and demand, read up on commodity trading.

Nonphixion · 08-08-2006, 04:03 AM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Maybe it does damage the economy, but no one seemed to care when the energy companies were losing their asses in the 1990s with ridiculous low prices.

Look I agree the system is broken or we wouldn't have had a need for so many mergers in the 1990s. The fact is american's use way too much energy whent hey could be doing simple things to reduce their consumption. Things as easy as light bulb changes go undone. There's many oil fired power plants inthis country, yet people continue to waste energy not just with their inneffecient cars but with inneffecient use around the house. Americans need to change the way they use energy otherwise you're right people will be pinched in the pocket book and consumer spending on other goods will indeed drop.

Our entire power grid is at it's failing point as well, congress has lobbied for reform, saying it is near-capacity. This planned change and/or upgrade would cost roughly 10 billion dollars per year, for the next 5 years. In so-far we have only spent under $3billion in the past few years, which has led to widespread failure and means impending blackouts during future high-energy periods.