Joe Biden tells it how it is VID - Page 2

Pro Street · 03-15-2007, 02:58 PM

it's funny to see someone say, "Bush has no plan rhetoric from the left"

ironic.

The difference is that Bush has given no "or else."

it's just a bunch of postering right now. It's smoke and mirrors.. so far the Surge has done nothing new. Again, how long are the surge troops supposed to remain? Bush said 6 or so months, now it's indefinite.

It seems as though the Administration is pretty much just winging it, and honestly they have nothing to lose right now.

JaJae · 03-15-2007, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by Scrum

Umm no. He did not follow Bidens plan at all.

Biden has been calling for us to divide the country into three "states" with a federal government controlling them. We are supposed to pull back to the borders and keep foreign interests from affecting things. We aren't doing those things.

So he's had a couple plans. It doesn't mean Bush didn't follow exactly what he defined as being a "plan." Yet here he's asserting Bush hasn't shown a plan. At the time Bush did exactly what Biden considered to be the best course of action and a plan.

Pro Street · 03-15-2007, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by JaJae

So he's had a couple plans. It doesn't mean Bush didn't follow exactly what he defined as being a "plan." Yet here he's asserting Bush hasn't shown a plan. At the time Bush did exactly what Biden considered to be the best course of action and a plan.

Biden said the best course of action was to increase troop levels by 21,000?

JaJae · 03-15-2007, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by Pro Street

it's funny to see someone say, "Bush has no plan rhetoric from the left"

It seems as though the Administration is pretty much just winging it, and honestly they have nothing to lose right now.

Is this the best rebuttal? It's funny and Bush is just winging it?

Bush is working to train security forces and limit the infighting/crossfire while attempting to make the Iraqi government/security forces stronger and united.

That takes time and continued work. Just because Bush hasn't changed his mind to this idea and decided a pullout (which Biden said isn't a plan) was the best option doesn't mean he isn't doing something in Iraq or there is no plan/future planned out. In fact, he essentially listened to what Biden said was a plan, and Biden criticized Bush for taking his advice.

Go figure. I understand "no plan" is catchy and it's cute. Hell I refer to "slow bleed" for the same reasons. But "slow bleed" is a satirical euphemism. "No plan" is not.

Scrum · 03-15-2007, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by JaJae

So he's had a couple plans. It doesn't mean Bush didn't follow exactly what he defined as being a "plan." Yet here he's asserting Bush hasn't shown a plan. At the time Bush did exactly what Biden considered to be the best course of action and a plan.

What Bush has been doing has nothing to do with Biden's plan.

Scrum · 03-15-2007, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by Pro Street

Biden said the best course of action was to increase troop levels by 21,000?

Nope. In fact....

YouTube Video

JaJae · 03-15-2007, 03:10 PM

Originally Posted by Pro Street

Biden said the best course of action was to increase troop levels by 21,000?

Bush clearly says in his speech while spitting in anger that Bush has had no plan. This is false and hypocritical. Just because he disagrees with Bush's current plan doesn't mean Bush has no plan now or no plan in the past. It's hypocritical at best. Diverting to him disagreeing with Bush currently doing is unrelated to the point I'm making.

Roonie · 03-15-2007, 03:15 PM

Here is Biden's plan for Iraq if anyone is interested

Plan For Iraq

Can someone post Bush's plan for ending this at some point?

Pro Street · 03-15-2007, 03:33 PM

Originally Posted by JaJae

Is this the best rebuttal? It's funny and Bush is just winging it?

Bush is working to train security forces and limit the infighting/crossfire while attempting to make the Iraqi government/security forces stronger and united.

That takes time and continued work. Just because Bush hasn't changed his mind to this idea and decided a pullout (which Biden said isn't a plan) was the best option doesn't mean he isn't doing something in Iraq or there is no plan/future planned out. In fact, he essentially listened to what Biden said was a plan, and Biden criticized Bush for taking his advice.

Go figure. I understand "no plan" is catchy and it's cute. Hell I refer to "slow bleed" for the same reasons. But "slow bleed" is a satirical euphemism. "No plan" is not.

slow bleed demonizes any plan not Bush's.

And The problem with Bush's plan is that it's both not enough and too much at the same time.

The thing is that his plan didn't have enough money to train the ISF. Not enough to give the troops equipment. It didn't allow for much at all, which is why they're again asking for another supplemental.

In addition, the problem I've stated is that there is no END for Bush's plan. NO END, No conclusion, nothing. There's no stated victory, he doesn't even want to change our force from invasion to support.

These are big issues...right now I don't see tossing in more troops as a plan, that's ALL that has been done.

Roonie · 03-15-2007, 03:39 PM

tossing in more troops is to fix his current plan. A bandaid on the ass of Iraq which is to say there is no real plan. No conclusion in sight. Every good plan has a beginning, a middle, and an end point.

Definition of plan (noun)
form plural: plans
program; scheme; agenda; timetable; schedule

Bush meets none of these criteria to call his ideas a plan.

Rouger2 · 03-15-2007, 04:23 PM

Biden is right those religious factions are never going to get along. We have no idea the passion they have for their religion. Maybe we had it once but not now, but it helps us be a united nation. The only plan is to seperate those people or they will do it themselves by killing each other. Biden still has my vote for president.