60 Minutes Special on Haditha, on the scene leader, Marine, interviewed

[Thorgrim]

Sergeant Wuterich said the Iraqi teens were running away from them so he shot them in the back after exiting a taxi

Excuse was that "well, they could have been the [IED] trigger man" that's what he was thinking in their head, and in his mind that was enough to shoot (to kill) them if they were walking away from him, even though they were unarmed

Says he heard 2 or 3 rifle shots from the south (not confirmed by the investigation) He did not see or hear any fire coming from the first house, he assumed it could have been the house, so it was designated hostile and told his troops to attack it

Told "shoot first, ask questions later"

Says he kicked in door, threw in grenade, and sent in troops to fire

Questioned on no hostile intent...he said it was "the chances we had to take"

After seeing he killed women and children, said it was more important to continue assault than worry they had killed women and children

Went into second house and threw in grenades, sent in men to open fire

Afterwards he said the people killed were not a threat

Marine says he feels if he had to do over again, he'd do the EXACT SAME THING

---

Another Iraqi soldier comes on CBS afterwards:

Veteran of 50 house clearings said identifying enemy before killing is esssential, have to know there are insurgents inside because they are attacking you, always you have to see them

"Yes" You have to see armed men before you fire

---End of Report--


Keep in mind, this isn't the prosecutors side, or the anti-war side

This entire post is the one-sided defense the Marine is offering for his own defense in murder charges

So this is the "best case scenario", with the lack of any counter-argument from the military which charged that he not only sent in men, but shot people as well

I think, if this is the best one-sided defense they have...these guys seem guilty as fuck, they just got their time to give a full defense and I don't think, even without a counter-argument, it stands up

People said wait for the trial, well you just heard the defendants arguments, do they convince you?

***Updated with poll, and confession of other marine
Sergeant Dela Cruz said that as he approached the taxi, he saw some men standing near it with their hands in the air, officials said. After Sergeant Wuterich shot them, he continued shooting as they lay on the ground, and later urinated on one of them
U.S. Inquiry Backs Charges of Killing by Marines in Iraq - New York Times

[smokie700]

He violated the Rules of engagement, point blank. Case closed. The best his defense should hope for is not getting death penalty.

[motivez]

This incident and the others like it have done a great deal of harm to our effort in Iraq and I hope they get the death penalty.

Not even looking at the horrible crimes they obviously committed, who knows how many more American and Iraqi lives have been lost as a result of new people being radicalized after hearing about these incidents?

[SoFlaJDM]

sounds to me like it's an everyday thing

[Phantom]

This is a tough situation. It's hard for me to blame the guy if he went berserk after his friend got blown up - I'm not sure I would have what it takes to not go nuts at that point.

Everything seems to point to this guy and his friends screwed up bad though.

[ballz2wallz]

It's an unfortunate and sad side of war. It's good that our country handles it properly though.

[Thorgrim]

poll added to give your opinion

[ballz2wallz]

I cannot pass a judgement like that based on a simple video of an interview. That's what the court system in our country is for.

[smokie700]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

poll added to give your opinion

which will serve what purpose? Story was posted and people added comments. You want the poll so you can get some sort of self gratifiying feeling from a sad situation.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

poll added to give your opinion

I don't think I can form an opinion with what I know. Watching that interview I do not believe this man to be a cold/hardened murderer. Whether he violated the laws or not isn't up for me to decide and if I were forced to give an opinion I honestly don't know what I'd say. I don't think we have enough of the specifics to form an opinion. Surely we can't take the word from people like Murtha who used him as a political stepping stone before an investigation was completed (or even started) and I think his personal opinion is obviously biased and skewed.

I think the courts are going to have a very tough decision ahead of them. Whether he's guilty of murder or not I can't decide on. But in my opinion he very likely is guilty of lesser charges, but the charge of murder I can't decide from the information I have. I think we need to wait for his trial and get the mitigating evidence before going on a the first hardball interview CBS has given this year and the word of Murtha.

I think the fact that they may not have been truthful from the start is really going to hurt him. I think this is a man who went to Iraq with good intentions and wanted to serve his country proudly. I can't bring myself to say he's either innocent or guilty at this point.

[kinggovernor]

Originally Posted by smokie700

He violated the Rules of engagement, point blank. Case closed. The best his defense should hope for is not getting death penalty.

violating the rules of engagement does not mean you automatically get the death penalty, in fact the opposite is quite true

[Thorgrim]

The 2007 leaked report, not from Murtha, gives both sides, but gives you a good view of the evidence the prosecutors have...that will be presented evidence

The Marine interviewed gave his full defense, they even had his lawyers on...

You have the defense and a big chunk of the prosecution, pretend the prosecution presented no more, would you find him guilty or not guilty?

It's pretty simple I'm surprised at the lack of voting

[SoFlaJDM]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

It's pretty simple I'm surprised at the lack of voting

you are? i'm not

[kinggovernor]

Originally Posted by SoFlaJDM

you are? i'm not

the civilian laws are different than the UCMJ laws. I am not sure if he should be convicted or not

[ballz2wallz]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

It's pretty simple I'm surprised at the lack of voting

We know nothing of what happened. Do I think he made mistakes? Sure. Do we all get the death penalty for making mistakes? Damn I hope not.

[motivez]

When those mistakes lead to the deaths of so many innocent people, violate the rules of engagement, and have most likely lead to the deaths of many other American soldiers..

[RMNIXON]

I would not make the mistake of voting the guilt or innocents of anyone based on 60 Minutes. Long before they were in the fake document business they were doing chop jobs with interviews. Not always political bias mind you, it is just smart TV to have clear bad guys and good guys. That is why some are smart enough to decline to be interviewed. Then 60 minutes makes a point of it as if that is an admission of guilt. They know it will be clipped to implicate the worst. CBS owns the film and can edit all they want. You say something, then explain it. But the last part gets cut. It is not just 60 Minutes or CBS, they all do it. Contrast that with a Bill O'Reilly interview which is LIVE!

[ballz2wallz]

Originally Posted by motivez

When those mistakes lead to the deaths of so many innocent people, violate the rules of engagement, and have most likely lead to the deaths of many other American soldiers..

Speculation doesn't hold much water in a court of law

[Thorgrim]

Uhm...the marine and his lawyers are not saying he was misrepresented in anyway whatsoever...

[ballz2wallz]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

Uhm...the marine and his lawyers are not saying he was misrepresented in anyway whatsoever...

Ok? And they'd be foolish to worry about 60 min...