Should LEGAL residents, NOT citizens be allowed to vote?

[Phantom]

Right to vote should definately be exclusive to citizens.

Residents are granted an opportunity to live and work here, but they make no oath of loyalty to the US. In my experience, residents for the most part are not loyal to the US, so they would not likely have the best interests of the country in mind when voting.

To become naturalized, a person must take an oath of loyalty, and pass minimum proficiency tests in both english and civics. I think this higher bar to citizenship and voting is one of the few parts of our immigration system that really works well.

[Sylkey]

Originally Posted by kinggovernor

that is one of the rules that you have to abide by if you want to live here. If you don't, you know where the door is.

Thanks for the friendly attitude. I would love to go home, but my two children are here and have been since they were 3, as you can imagine I cannot leave my children and grandchildren. And if you read my post you would see that I say it is hard to see it go on and not get to vote, but I agree that it should be a right granted to citizens only. So please restrain next time you want to snarl "you know where the door is"

[Sylkey]

Originally Posted by 03 white zx3

It seems to me that paying into social security knowing you will not be able to use it is also the "price you pay" for not being a citizen. It sucks, but that is a choice you made.

How long do you plan on living in the United States? Will you ever go back to Britain?

I do not plan to go back unless my grown children decided to go back. I have lived here for 21 years, my children are both 23, and one grandchild. For 21 years I have worked, paid taxes, social security. It saddens me that I cannot vote, but its the price I pay for being near my children.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Sylkey

I do not plan to go back unless my grown children decided to go back. I have lived here for 21 years, my children are both 23, and one grandchild. For 21 years I have worked, paid taxes, social security. It saddens me that I cannot vote, but its the price I pay for being near my children.

But it seems like you understand that is a choice you have made. You chose to live close to your kids knowing you can't vote unless you become a citizen. I see no problem with that system

Originally Posted by Sylkey

I do not plan to go back unless my grown children decided to go back. I have lived here for 21 years, my children are both 23, and one grandchild. For 21 years I have worked, paid taxes, social security. It saddens me that I cannot vote, but its the price I pay for being near my children.

I guess I can't claim to understand. It seems to me that you could fairly easily gain voting rights (as well as the rights to your SS monies) by becoming a citizen, yet you CHOOSE not to. You have the CHOICE to receive the same rights as us by becoming a citizen. IMO you can't really complain about not having the right to vote here when you are choosing to retain your British citizenship.

[Sylkey]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

But it seems like you understand that is a choice you have made. You chose to live close to your kids knowing you can't vote unless you become a citizen. I see no problem with that system

Neither do I, I never said I did have a problem with it, I would not want people who are not citizens of Great Britain having the right to vote. What I did have a problem with was the nasty attitude Kinggovenor had towards me, there was no reason to be so rude to a legal, law-abiding, hardworking resident of this country.

The whole rebate on the taxes would not work either, taxes pay for the roads you drive on, the unemployment you get if you need it. Now social security is another matter, I will not collect it unless I become a citizen before I am 65 (whatever the age is).

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by Sylkey

...taxes pay for the roads you drive on, the unemployment you get if you need it....

Not to nitpick, but unemployment is not paid with tax money. It's an insurance you and your employer pay into.

[Sylkey]

Originally Posted by 03 white zx3

I guess I can't claim to understand. It seems to me that you could fairly easily gain voting rights (as well as the rights to your SS monies) by becoming a citizen, yet you CHOOSE not to. You have the CHOICE to receive the same rights as us by becoming a citizen. IMO you can't really complain about not having the right to vote here when you are choosing to retain your British citizenship.

gawd bless! Have you read my posts???? I said I agree with non-citizens not have the vote!!!!!!

And think just for a second, could you give up being American? If its something you hold dear, its not given up easily.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Scrum

Not to nitpick, but unemployment is not paid with tax money. It's an insurance you and your employer pay into.

that is a tax

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Sylkey

Neither do I, I never said I did have a problem with it, I would not want people who are not citizens of Great Britain having the right to vote. What I did have a problem with was the nasty attitude Kinggovenor had towards me, there was no reason to be so rude to a legal, law-abiding, hardworking resident of this country.

The whole rebate on the taxes would not work either, taxes pay for the roads you drive on, the unemployment you get if you need it. Now social security is another matter, I will not collect it unless I become a citizen before I am 65 (whatever the age is).

I agree that if you're a legal law abiding citizen we need your labor.

Originally Posted by Sylkey

gawd bless! Have you read my posts???? I said I agree with non-citizens not have the vote!!!!!!

And think just for a second, could you give up being American? If its something you hold dear, its not given up easily.

If I hadn't lived in the country for 21 years? I'd probably consider it.

I apologize if I missed the part where you said non-citizens shouldn't have the right to vote, I thought you were whining about having to pay taxes and not receiving the same rights.

[Diesel66]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

that is a tax

Its not a tax unless you believe your personal car insurance is a tax because the govt forces you to have it to drive on public streets.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Diesel66

Its not a tax unless you believe your personal car insurance is a tax because the govt forces you to have it to drive on public streets.

Car insurance and unemployment insurance are completely different furthermore my automotive insurance is configurable to what I want.

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

that is a tax

No it isn't.

Your employer pays into unemployment coverage.
When you collect unemployment it's like filing a claim, at least in my state. Maybe some places handle if differently.

[Linzyhop]

Originally Posted by Sylkey

gawd bless! Have you read my posts???? I said I agree with non-citizens not have the vote!!!!!!

And think just for a second, could you give up being American? If its something you hold dear, its not given up easily.

my good friend just took her citizenship test today (she sent me a text asking who two massachusetts senators were)... but she's from Rio de Janiero and she's going to be able to retain her Brazilian citizenship still... i'm not sure how she's managing that one considering both parents were Brazilian.. but i'm going out to lunch with her in an hour and i'll ask.....

[Linzyhop]

so she said Brazilians can have dual citizenship, so that's cool for her. she gets to be sworn in as a citizen on July 23rd. we were briefly talking about the illegal immigrants in the country and she said that Martha's Vineyard (an island off Massachusetts for those that don't know) has been having a huge influx of illegal Brazilians lately. she said it upsets her because she's taken the time to do things right, it's been 5 years, she's spent at least $10,000 in legal fees and due process and she finds it incredibly frustrating seeing all these illegals coming over and bypassing the whole process and fucking with what she has taken the time to do.. and knowing they don't even care about the US anyway... good for her. we need immigrants that have gone through the process to step up and say in front of congress how it effects them to see the illegals getting away with so much shit......

[Kytro]

Originally Posted by Diesel66

Its not a tax unless you believe your personal car insurance is a tax because the govt forces you to have it to drive on public streets.

Effectively, yes.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Scrum

No it isn't.

Your employer pays into unemployment coverage.
When you collect unemployment it's like filing a claim, at least in my state. Maybe some places handle if differently.

It is no different than Social Security. I pay in or my employer pays in which really just raises the cost of employment for the business. it is a tax, no matter how you slice it.

Don't get me wrong I think we need unemployment coverage in this country but it is a tax.