Update: felony charges - Page 3

ballz2wallz · 07-20-2007, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Hiding guns is NOT a responsible action and it is NOT the same as securing them. Even if there weren't a law against it...it's still not responsible

Not less responsible than putting it in a drawer next to your bed

motivez · 07-20-2007, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Stylerod

I know that's why I made that post. Ballz was obviously wrong and I hope he can get out of it with no charges.

It should not be a crime to have a gun in your locked house. Makes me glad I live in a red state.

Not red for long

Donkey® · 07-20-2007, 11:59 AM

Originally Posted by motivez

Is there a real problem in MA with guns being stolen and then used in other crimes?

I'm kind of interested after all of this in learning where most of the "underground" or "street" guns come from. Are they sold by shady dealers, or stolen, etc?

Stolen guns are a huge part of the problem. Yes, people stealing them is a problem. Yes, people selling them is a problem. But it's like blaming Missy and Frank for buying that blood diamond when the people working the slave camps digging up the raw stones are really to blame.

Linzyhop · 07-20-2007, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Because this post is relevant in any way, shape or form.

see. can't go one thread without attacking someone's opinion.

nice. real nice.

it's very relevant and i'm sure plenty of other people would agree. it's showing a POINT that the law is stupid and there are plenty of other stupid laws on the books (such as one i just gave an example of it.)

here you go. maybe this will help:

Relevance is a term used to describe how pertinent, connected, or applicable some information is to a given matter.

Stylerod · 07-20-2007, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by motivez

Not red for long

Yeah, let's pray that some Democrats can fuck with our 2nd amendment our rights here too!

Donkey® · 07-20-2007, 12:02 PM

Originally Posted by Stylerod

I know that's why I made that post. Ballz was obviously wrong and I hope he can get out of it with no charges.

It should not be a crime to have a gun in your locked house. Makes me glad I live in a red state.

"locked house" is not secure. There's a reason you keep your money in a bank. "Locked house" is the same as all those "Feel good" security tactics DC throws at us with searches at airports and subways.

I really hope he gets off too. I think it is stupid in principle but I also think that as a gun owner, one should take extra steps to keep the gun out of a criminals hands.

Publius · 07-20-2007, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Stolen guns are a huge part of the problem. Yes, people stealing them is a problem. Yes, people selling them is a problem. But it's like blaming Missy and Frank for buying that blood diamond when the people working the slave camps digging up the raw stones are really to blame.

so in other words, you don't want to blame the criminals that broke into his house and stole the guns, you REALLY, when you get down to the very basics, want to blame ballz for even having the guns in the first place, and punish him for it.

A gun safe won't stop a criminal that really wants to get at your guns, if nothing else they'll just take the whole safe with them and crack it at their leisure. A gun safe is really pretty useless when it comes to preventing gun theft, it's only real useful purpose is as a way to prevent curious children from getting the firearm.

motivez · 07-20-2007, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by Stylerod

Yeah, let's pray that some Democrats can fuck with our 2nd amendment our rights here too!

I'd much rather have representatives that care about other parts of the Constitution as well, and no southern democrat is going to vote away gun rights.

NC is going blue, has been for years. It's a good thing, considering the pathetic state of the Republican party.

Donkey® · 07-20-2007, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by ballz2wallz

Not less responsible than putting it in a drawer next to your bed

In your opinion. To me it's the same as leaving young kids alone at home on the responsibility level.

motivez · 07-20-2007, 12:05 PM

So, Donkey, again, where is the line drawn?

Does it need to be in a safe, within a safe, within a safe, hidden inside a secret room that has a moat around it with sharks who have lasers attached to their fricken foreheads?

Do you not think the people who stole the guns are responsible for their actions? And that any crimes committed with those weapons are the fault of the people who committed the crimes?

Donkey® · 07-20-2007, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Publius

so in other words, you don't want to blame the criminals that broke into his house and stole the guns, you REALLY, when you get down to the very basics, want to blame ballz for even having the guns in the first place, and punish him for it.

I don't want to punish Ballz. It isn't my job to do that.

Originally Posted by Publius

A gun safe won't stop a criminal that really wants to get at your guns, if nothing else they'll just take the whole safe with them and crack it at their leisure. A gun safe is really pretty useless when it comes to preventing gun theft, it's only real useful purpose is as a way to prevent curious children from getting the firearm.

So we might as well not be required to wear seatbelts on planes or lifejackets on boats because there are still other ways we can die. Doing SOMETHING is better than saying "fuck it, they are not really safe anyway".

Publius · 07-20-2007, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

"locked house" is not secure. There's a reason you keep your money in a bank. "Locked house" is the same as all those "Feel good" security tactics DC throws at us with searches at airports and subways.

I really hope he gets off too. I think it is stupid in principle but I also think that as a gun owner, one should take extra steps to keep the gun out of a criminals hands.

A gun safe is nothing but a feel good security tactic when it comes to the issue of gun theft as well. The only thing a safe prevents is a child from getting the gun, a criminal dedicated to taking the firearm will either crack the safe in the home and take the firearms or just take the entire safe with them and crack it at their leisure.

ballz2wallz · 07-20-2007, 12:06 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

In your opinion. To me it's the same as leaving young kids alone at home on the responsibility level.

What's the point of having a gun to protect yourself in the case of an intrustion while at home if you have to ask the intruder to give you a second while you get the gun out of your safe, get the ammo out from a different location, and calmly load the gun?

There seems to be a malfunction in your logical process

ballz2wallz · 07-20-2007, 12:07 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

So we might as well not be required to wear seatbelts on planes or lifejackets on boats because there are still other ways we can die. Doing SOMETHING is better than saying "fuck it, they are not really safe anyway".

I agree with both of those

The government shouldn't force me to wear a seatbelt or a lifejacket...I'm not hurting anybody else but myself.

Donkey® · 07-20-2007, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by motivez

So, Donkey, again, where is the line drawn?

Does it need to be in a safe, within a safe, within a safe, hidden inside a secret room that has a moat around it with sharks who have lasers attached to their fricken foreheads?

A safe of some sort is the least that should be done. Better than nothing.

Originally Posted by motivez

Do you not think the people who stole the guns are responsible for their actions? And that any crimes committed with those weapons are the fault of the people who committed the crimes?

Of course. They should be caught and prosecuted. But there is an argument that says "none of this would have happened if the guns were locked up."

Publius · 07-20-2007, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

I don't want to punish Ballz. It isn't my job to do that.

but you admit you want to blame him for the guns being stolen, not the CRIMINALS that BROKE INTO HIS HOUSE and stole them?

So we might as well not be required to wear seatbelts on planes or lifejackets on boats because there are still other ways we can die. Doing SOMETHING is better than saying "fuck it, they are not really safe anyway".

"oh look, i can make a strawman argument!11!11!"

I'd like to see statistics that prove that a gun safe significantly reduces the number of guns stolen in break-ins where the criminal in specifically seeking out firearms. I'd be willing to bet there is pretty much zero reduction in gun theft in that situation.

Donkey® · 07-20-2007, 12:10 PM

I'll get back to this later...team build at work.

Linzyhop · 07-20-2007, 12:11 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

A safe of some sort is the least that should be done. Better than nothing.

it's not nothing.

nothing is not having them behind locked doors, wrapped up and stored in a hidden out of the way place.

Stylerod · 07-20-2007, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by motivez

So, Donkey, again, where is the line drawn?

Does it need to be in a safe, within a safe, within a safe, hidden inside a secret room that has a moat around it with sharks who have lasers attached to their fricken foreheads?

Do you not think the people who stole the guns are responsible for their actions? And that any crimes committed with those weapons are the fault of the people who committed the crimes?

I love a post with an Austin Power reference.

avsp · 07-20-2007, 12:24 PM

can someone confirm that i understand this correctly

the felony is having a gun that could have more than 6 rounds.

the house in question wasnt secure as there was an open window with a jerry-rgged AC unit blocking it.