Do you buy into this "new age" medicine?

[infinite loop]

what type of new age medicine are yuo talking about?

i know some methods, like acupuncture, are gaining acceptance in western medicine. the results are mixed, but some docs do perscribe it in addition to physical/occupational therapy for rehab work.

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by infinite loop

what type of new age medicine are yuo talking about?

i know some methods, like acupuncture, are gaining acceptance in western medicine. the results are mixed, but some docs do perscribe it in addition to physical/occupational therapy for rehab work.

If a doctor ever suggested I go to a chiropractor, I'd stop seeing him. If he wants me to get physical therapy for my back, then I want to go to a physical therapist, not a "doctor" with no medical training.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

If a doctor ever suggested I go to a chiropractor, I'd stop seeing him. If he wants me to get physical therapy for my back, then I want to go to a physical therapist, not a "doctor" with no medical training.

Chiropractors are actually really good as long as you go to an actual Doctor of Chiropractic (DC). I had a pinched nerve in my lower back and went to one, he cracked me a few times over 3 sessions, and I've not had a problem since.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

If a doctor ever suggested I go to a chiropractor, I'd stop seeing him. If he wants me to get physical therapy for my back, then I want to go to a physical therapist, not a "doctor" with no medical training.

there was something on a news show the other night about how more physical therapists are doing chiropractic..... it's not a scam if it works.

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by Publius

Chiropractors are actually really good as long as you go to an actual Doctor of Chiropractic (DC). I had a pinched nerve in my lower back and went to one, he cracked me a few times over 3 sessions, and I've not had a problem since.

Doctor of Chiropractic? lol, there is no science to chiropractic. The ones that are most qualified are trained in physical therapy, but charge more.

Chiropractors are nothing more than glorified physical therapists, but can practice without any sort of physical therapy license.

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by 7960

there was something on a news show the other night about how more physical therapists are doing chiropractic..... it's not a scam if it works.

no no, you have it backwards. The physical therapy you get from a chripractor is real, the other shit is not.

For instance, toxins in your joints cause cancer, so by visiting a chirpractor you can not only prevent from getting cancer, but cure it.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

no no, you have it backwards. The physical therapy you get from a chripractor is real, the other shit is not.

For instance, toxins in your joints cause cancer, so by visiting a chirpractor you can not only prevent from getting cancer, but cure it.

what?

[Ardentfrost]

You're saying physical therapists are using chirpractic practice, but it's the chiropractors that started using physical therapy to make them more legitimate.

Chiropractic has been around for a long time, and is based around your joints controlling all bad things that go on in your body. So, anything that goes wrong with you can be fixed by straightening out some joints. The back was a focus for later, specifically after they started more physical therapy stuff.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Doctor of Chiropractic? lol, there is no science to chiropractic. The ones that are most qualified are trained in physical therapy, but charge more.

Chiropractors are nothing more than glorified physical therapists, but can practice without any sort of physical therapy license.

D.C. is an actual degree and doctoral field recognized by the AMA.

Studies on Chiropractic medicine (from wikipedia):

The Manga Report
The Manga Report was an outcomes-study funded by the Ontario Ministry of Health and conducted by three health economists led by University of Ottawa Professor Pran Manga, Ph.D. The Manga Report overwhelmingly supported the scientific validity, safety, efficacy, and cost-effectiveness of chiropractic for low-back pain. Additionally, it found that higher patient satisfaction levels were associated with chiropractic care than with medical treatment alternatives. The report states, "The literature clearly and consistently shows that the major savings from chiropractic management come from fewer and lower costs of auxiliary services, fewer hospitalizations, and a highly significant reduction in chronic problems, as well as in levels and duration of disability." [47]

[edit]
Workers' Compensation studies
A 1998 study of 10,652 Florida workers' compensation cases was conducted by Steve Wolk, Ph.D., and reported by the Foundation for Chiropractic Education and Research. It was concluded that "a claimant with a back-related injury, when initially treated by a chiropractor versus a medical doctor, is less likely to become temporarily disabled, or if disabled, remains disabled for a shorter period of time; and claimants treated by medical doctors were hospitalized at a much higher rate than claimants treated by chiropractors."[48]

A 1991 study of Oregon Workers' Compensation Claims examined 201 randomly selected workers' compensation cases that involved low back injuries that were disabling. Study found individuals who visited DCs less often initially went to the hospital for their injuries than those visiting MDs. Those who visited DCs often had a history of chronic back pain.[49]

A second part of the Oregon Workers' Compensation reported on the loss of time for individuals who visited DCs and those who visited MDs for treatment of low back pain. Median missed days of work for individuals with similar severity of injury was 9.0 days for those visiting DCs and 11.5 for individuals visiting MDs. Individuals visiting chiropractors more often returned to work having missed one week or less of work days. There was no difference in time lost for individuals visiting DCs and MDs with no previous history of low back pain. The median of days missed of work for individuals who had chronic back pain and visited MDs was 34.5 days while the median of days missed of work for those visiting DCs was 9 days.[50]

A 1989 study analyzed data on Iowa state record from individuals in Iowa who filed claims for back or neck injuries in 1984. The study compared benefits and the cost of care received by individuals from MDs, DCs and DOs. There was a focus on individuals who missed days of work and were compensated because of their injuries. Individuals who visited DCs missed on average at least 2.3 days less than individuals who visited MDs and 3.8 days less than individuals who saw DOs. Less money was dispersed as employment compensation on average for individuals who visited DCs. On average, the disability compensation paid to workers for those who visited DCs was $263.66, $617.85 for those who visited MDs, and was $1565.05 for those who visited DOs. [51]

In 1989, a survey administered by Daniel C. Cherkin, Ph.D., and Frederick A. MacCornack, Ph.D., concluded that patients receiving care from health maintenance organizations (HMOs) within the state of Washington were three times as likely to report satisfaction with care from chiropractors as they were with care from other physicians. The patients were also more likely to believe that their chiropractor was concerned about them. [52]

[edit]
American Medical Association
In 1997, the following statement was adopted as policy of the American Medical Association (AMA) after a report on a number of alternative therapies:[16]

Specifically about chiropractic it said,

"Manipulation has been shown to have a reasonably good degree of efficacy in ameliorating back pain, headache, and similar musculoskeletal complaints."
And in 1992, the AMA issued this statement regarding their code of ethics for medical doctors associating with chiropractors:

"It is ethical for a physician to associate professionally with chiropractors provided that the physician believes that such association is in the best interests of his or her patient. A physician may refer a patient for diagnostic or therapeutic services to a chiropractor permitted by law to furnish such services whenever the physician believes that this may benefit his or her patient. Physicians may also ethically teach in recognized schools of chiropractic. (V, VI)"[17]
[edit]
British Medical Association
The British Medical Association notes that "There is also no problem with GPs [doctors] referring patients to practitioners in osteopathy and chiropractic who are registered with the relevant statutory regulatory bodies, as a similar means of redress is available to the patient."[53]

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

If a doctor ever suggested I go to a chiropractor, I'd stop seeing him. If he wants me to get physical therapy for my back, then I want to go to a physical therapist, not a "doctor" with no medical training.

I went to a great physical therapist a few years ago for back problems. This guy is pretty good; he's one of the department heads at USC's physical therapy program and he saw some value with going to a chiropractor.

the spine specialist i saw for my back problems told me to avoid chiros because "you can't put a man on the moon with what they do, stick with science." when i asked for my therapist's take on it, he said that a chiropractor can cause some good, but shouldn't be the only form of therapy.

i think not being receptive towards alternative treatment options is a bad move.

[Ardentfrost]

Yeah, I've seen all that before... but the fact remains that what they're actually studying to get the DC is physical therapy... except they charge more.

I was a juror on a case last year where the guy wanted compensation for chiropractic care from a guy that hit him with a car. I would have NOT given it to him... so the's lucky as shit they settled before we had to deliberate.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by 7960

there was something on a news show the other night about how more physical therapists are doing chiropractic..... it's not a scam if it works.

yep. my therapist would do some motions very similar to that of a chripractor. of course the therapist did a hell of a lot more stretching, massaging, strengthening, etc.

[Ardentfrost]

If it's something that can't be proven with science, then we shouldn't be putting any value in it... I say this and I'm a Christian too This does not conflict with my beliefs because I believe God wants us to meet him halfway, so if someone gets cancer and refuses treatment because they believe God will save them, I am not surprised when they die.

But that's neither here nor there, the point is that if science can't say for certain that something is, then I will not put any stock in it until they do.

And like I said early in the thread, diet and shit doesn't count, because that is proven by science. I'm also an advocate of self medication.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

If it's something that can't be proven with science, then we shouldn't be putting any value in it... I say this and I'm a Christian too This does not conflict with my beliefs because I believe God wants us to meet him halfway, so if someone gets cancer and refuses treatment because they believe God will save them, I am not surprised when they die.

But that's neither here nor there, the point is that if science can't say for certain that something is, then I will not put any stock in it until they do.

And like I said early in the thread, diet and shit doesn't count, because that is proven by science. I'm also an advocate of self medication.

Listen, I understand where you're coming from. I went into this with a very skeptical but open mind, I didn't think it would work and I was wasting my time. But the insurance paid for 80% of it and nothing else was working, so I looked one up and went to him. I was amazed, I felt so much better just after the first session, and by the end of my 3rd session (in 6 days, the pain was so debilitating that he had me come in every other day) I felt fine again.

I don't care if what he was doing is necessarily chiropractic or physical therapist in nature, it worked and cost me less than PT would have.

[IminWonderland]

I use pot to cure alot of things...

PMS...Mood Swings...Deppression...Anxiety....Insomnia....

Is that new age?

[Publius]

Originally Posted by IminWonderland

I use pot to cure alot of things...

PMS...Mood Swings...Deppression...Anxiety....Insomnia....

Is that new age?

Yes and no. A lot of things termed "new age" are actual MUCH older than the medical establishment that terms them that (like acupuncture and the like).

[Ardentfrost]

Pot isn't new age, it chemically affects your body in a very expected way.

[Ardentfrost]

It cost you less than seeing a PT? That is strange. I know a few PT's and they are far less expensive than Chiros because generally Chiros want you in there all the time, whereas PT's put you on a rehabilitation schedule.

I guess if you just used the Chiro as a PT and never went back, it would be less expensive

[Publius]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Pot isn't new age, it chemically affects your body in a very expected way.

Agreed, but the medical establishment claims using it for certain diseases is a "new age" cure.