YearlyKos attacks man in uniform

JaJae · 08-03-2007, 06:00 PM

As the Military and Progressives panel came to an end, a young man in uniform stood up to argue that the surge was working, and cutting down on Iraqi casualties. The moderator largely freaked out. When other members of the panel tried to answer his question, he demanded they "stand down." He demanded the questioner give his name, the name of his commander, and the name of his unit. And then he closed the panel, no answer offered or allowed, and stalked off the stage,

Wes Clark took the mic and tried to explain what had just occurred: The argument appears to be that you're not allowed to participate in politics while wearing a uniform, or at least that you shouldn't, and that the questioner was engaging in a sort of moral blackmail, not to mention a violation of the rules, by doing so. Knowing fairly little about the army, I can't speak to any of that. But it was an uncomfortable few moments, and seemed fairly contrary to the spirit of the panel to roar down the member of the military who tried to speak with a contrary voice.

A man in uniform at the YearlyKos tried to say that the surge was working and Iraqi deaths are lower because of it. He was then yelled at to "stand down" and was asked questions such as:
What's your name?
Who's your commander?
What's your unit?
Etc

Basically they refused to answer his questions, berated him and asked him personal questions about his military status as if to get him in trouble with the military justice system.

This is how YearlyKos is seemingly dealing with counter opinion at their "festivities." This is a disgrace and they should treat our servicemen with more respect. If he had stood up and said the surge wasn't working the response would have been completely different. This is how they support our troops... very nice.

I wonder if this will be on O'Rielly tonight. This wasn't just any visitor or generic DailyKos follower. This despicable display of intimidation from the moderator of the event is by all means uncalled for. He disgraced the meeting.

RMNIXON · 08-03-2007, 06:19 PM

Did someone tell these rules to the Vietnam protestors in Uniform?

John Kerry?

And when did Kos become so concerned with the Fascist "Establishment Rules?"

Or are they just Fascists about Opinions they don't want to hear?

But I already knew that............................

RMNIXON · 08-03-2007, 06:24 PM

Originally Posted by JaJae

What's your name?
Who's your commander?
What's your unit?
Etc

Basically they refused to answer his questions, berated him and asked him personal questions about his military status as if to get him in trouble with the military justice system.

Where are your papers?

DosEquis · 08-03-2007, 06:35 PM

I am failing to see what the big deal is. People of differing opinions are escorted out of conservative venues all the time, and often times arrested. You can post all the "anti-left" or democrat bashing material you want... but this is something we have seen from conservatives since 1/2000.

Per the person writing the story, Wes Clark stated that a man actively serving in uniform should avoid being involved in politics. The young soldier should have probably avoided the situation in the first place, regardless if his views were in support of yearlykos or against.

Roonie · 08-03-2007, 06:45 PM

Originally Posted by DosEquis

I am failing to see what the big deal is. People of differing opinions are escorted out of conservative venues all the time, and often times arrested. You can post all the "anti-left" or democrat bashing material you want... but this is something we have seen from conservatives since 1/2000.

Per the person writing the story, Wes Clark stated that a man actively serving in uniform should avoid being involved in politics. The young soldier should have probably avoided the situation in the first place, regardless if his views were in support of yearlykos or against.

double

garbagemanlb · 08-03-2007, 07:51 PM

Originally Posted by JaJae

Hugh Hewitt

A man in uniform at the YearlyKos tried to say that the surge was working and Iraqi deaths are lower because of it. He was then yelled at to "stand down" and was asked questions such as:
What's your name?
Who's your commander?
What's your unit?
Etc

Basically they refused to answer his questions, berated him and asked him personal questions about his military status as if to get him in trouble with the military justice system.

This is how YearlyKos is seemingly dealing with counter opinion at their "festivities." This is a disgrace and they should treat our servicemen with more respect. If he had stood up and said the surge wasn't working the response would have been completely different. This is how they support our troops... very nice.

I wonder if this will be on O'Rielly tonight. This wasn't just any visitor or generic DailyKos follower. This despicable display of intimidation from the moderator of the event is by all means uncalled for. He disgraced the meeting.

DailyKos is no better than the nazis and the kkk.

And of course this will be on O'Reilly...ever since some members of DailyKos basically called out his hypocricy he has been foaming at the mouth whenever Dailykos is mentioned.

RMNIXON · 08-03-2007, 08:24 PM

Originally Posted by garbagemanlb

DailyKos is no better than the nazis and the kkk.

They are like Fascists if demanding identity, Unit, and Chain of Command in a public debate forum. Where did I post anything like KKK?

Garbage in, Garbage out....................

Donkey® · 08-03-2007, 10:00 PM

These types of things happen at OFFICIAL Republican events all the time...except people are normally dragged out by the secret service or security or the police. I guess the people being attacked in this thread should be commended for not throwing the soldier in the brig.

garbagemanlb · 08-04-2007, 12:20 AM

Originally Posted by RMNIXON

They are like Fascists if demanding identity, Unit, and Chain of Command in a public debate forum. Where did I post anything like KKK?

Garbage in, Garbage out....................

Yeah, you sure have them nailed.

I can definately tell you regularly go to that site.

Thorgrim · 08-04-2007, 12:42 AM

This is the biggest joke I've ever seen, seriously this is lower than the Kerry Christmas cards...

EVERYONE knows you are not allowed to use your uniform to speak out on political views, there were SEVERAL veterans there that were offended that some asshat decides he can break all the rules

Do you have any idea how many military veterans want to suit up in full uniform and denouce the war? No, they have to put on tshirts and jeans and go on VoteVets ads

PLUS, this is a partisan conventiosn, you think the RNC puts up with that kind of disruptive bullshit

For the 999999999999999999th time, DailyKos and YearlyKos both have the primary aim of electing Democrats and other partisan ends...its stated clearly on the website and was made very clear to those attending...this is not a free and open forum to start marching around with GOP-talking points

What's next, is Al Gore allowed to interupt the Republican nominee and pelt him with global warming conventions at the RNC 2008?

fucking pathetic

JaJae · 08-04-2007, 12:53 AM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

EVERYONE knows you are not allowed to use your uniform to speak out on political views, there were SEVERAL veterans there that were offended that some asshat decides he can break all the rules

And everyone knows they wouldn't have given to shits if his message was in line with theirs. They wouldn't have silenced him or tried to intimidate him.

Thorgrim · 08-04-2007, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by JaJae

And everyone knows they wouldn't have given to shits if his message was in line with theirs. They wouldn't have silenced him or tried to intimidate him.

How many other people were wearing uniforms...when these other veterans peacefully got together in a private convention hall using their own money to talk about their political agenda

For all we know, he wasn't even a veteran, he was just a guy in a costume

And so how many questions is Al Gore allowed to ask the GOP nominee at the 2008 RNC?

SpicyMcVoodoo · 08-04-2007, 02:08 AM

Why did this guy even wear a uniform? He could've stood up, explained he was in the military, and then made his point. If a doctor wants to make an argument about socialized medicine at a convention, he doesn't wear scrubs. If a factory worker wants to complain about working conditions, he doesn't show up wearing a helmet and ear plugs.

The fact that he walked into a room for of anti-war liberals wearing a military uniform for no apparent reason strikes me as intending to bait these people, that way people like the thread starter could complain that "a man in uniform was attacked." So, JaJae, thanks for carrying out the plan as intended.

garbagemanlb · 08-04-2007, 02:51 AM

Originally Posted by JaJae

And everyone knows they wouldn't have given to shits if his message was in line with theirs. They wouldn't have silenced him or tried to intimidate him.

If only this had been a conservative group meeting, and the soldier a liberal...they would have sat down and calmly reasoned with the man, I am sure.

JaJae · 08-04-2007, 03:15 AM

Originally Posted by garbagemanlb

If only this had been a conservative group meeting, and the soldier a liberal...they would have sat down and calmly reasoned with the man, I am sure.

If they hadn't I'd call it despicable as well... But they didn't. This was an invited guest who was invited to ask a question and when that question went against their ideology, they attacked.

P/N · 08-04-2007, 04:23 AM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

This is the biggest joke I've ever seen, seriously this is lower than the Kerry Christmas cards...

EVERYONE knows you are not allowed to use your uniform to speak out on political views, there were SEVERAL veterans there that were offended that some asshat decides he can break all the rules

Do you have any idea how many military veterans want to suit up in full uniform and denouce the war? No, they have to put on tshirts and jeans and go on VoteVets ads

PLUS, this is a partisan conventiosn, you think the RNC puts up with that kind of disruptive bullshit

For the 999999999999999999th time, DailyKos and YearlyKos both have the primary aim of electing Democrats and other partisan ends...its stated clearly on the website and was made very clear to those attending...this is not a free and open forum to start marching around with GOP-talking points

What's next, is Al Gore allowed to interupt the Republican nominee and pelt him with global warming conventions at the RNC 2008?

fucking pathetic

What fucking political views? He said the surge is working. This isn't a political view, it is a god damned fact. It's only those who are left of center that think this man's statement is a political view. And then you call him an asshat to boot? Have you ever served in the military?

I agree with the second part of your post (non-bolded). This is a partisan convention. But unlike O'Reilly, who allows the opposing viewpoint on his program, these guys didn't. The right doesn't allow opposing viewpoints either. So, I guess, by your own standards, O'Reilly is less partisan than either side when it comes to opposing viewpoints.

I think this is much ado about nothing IMO. This didn't shock me one bit. What is "fucking pathetic" is that certain people will spin this story into someone giving their political opinion when they are simply stating a fact, only because they are upset somehow that the surge may actually be doing some good and progress is being made.

motivez · 08-04-2007, 04:39 AM

Originally Posted by P/N

What fucking political views? He said the surge is working. This isn't a political view, it is a god damned fact.

According to who? Bush's lacky Generals who only tell him what he wants to hear for fear of being fired?

Every sign I've seen points to the fact that the surge hasn't changed anything that matters. There's no military solutions in Iraq, only political ones.. and the largest Sunni bloc recently QUIT the coalition government.

Doesn't seem like progress to me.

P/N · 08-04-2007, 05:55 AM

Originally Posted by motivez

According to who? Bush's lacky Generals who only tell him what he wants to hear for fear of being fired?

Every sign I've seen points to the fact that the surge hasn't changed anything that matters. There's no military solutions in Iraq, only political ones.. and the largest Sunni bloc recently QUIT the coalition government.

Doesn't seem like progress to me.

US to be in Iraq 'for years' | Herald Sun

Official figures showed 74 American service members were killed in Iraq in July, the lowest figure since November, when 70 died.

This doesn't matter? I thought the plight of the "pull out now" crowd depended on increasing US casualties as a leg to stand on. Looks to me like they just got that leg kicked ouf from under them.

Now it's not all good news:

At least 1652 civilians were killed in Iraq in July, one third more than in the previous month, according to figures compiled from three Iraqi ministries.

But can't this be attributed to the other leg the "pull out now" crowd stands on - "There is Civil War in Iraq". Of course there is Civil War taking place in Iraq, but the surge has increased the number of troops, so logically the number of Iraqi casualties will grow as well (I know I'm using logic and common sense, so this is where I may lose some of you).

I will give you partial credit for your use of "political solutions". Military solutions are still needed, but the political solutions are the main ingredient to success in Iraq. What needs to be made perfectly clear though, is that these solutions are Iraqi political solutions and not US political solutions.

Just to give you some background on my feelings towards this war, I supported it in the beginning. Our military performed their job flawlessly on their way to topple Saddam's regime. The threat was too great to ignore, and we were "damned if we did" and "damned if we didn't" take out Saddam. Since that flawless overthrow, the planning for a post-Saddam Iraq has been nothing short of a major cluster-fuck. This is war and things don't always go as planned in war, but there should have been more than just one plan for stablilty. This administration should have had solutions in place before we invaded, not pulling shit out of their asses as problems arise. I don't agree with simply pulling out, as many on here (and across this country) do. I served in our nation's military and I will say that pulling out now would be a great dishonesty to those who have fallen thus far. The surge needs to be given a shot to work, but the Iraqi's must take more responsibility from a political standpoint than they are currently taking. The troop surge will be a disaster if the Iraqi government doesn't start to do something.

Vietnam was lost because it was fought by our politicians instead of the people on the ground. If we allow our politicians to determine the strategy and outcome of this war, it will be a much larger disaster than Vietnam. I have supported the surge from the first mention of it. In fact, it should have happened long ago. Having held off on the extra troops for so long, we allowed the insurgents to gain even stronger footing before the extra troops arrived. But the fact remains, Iraq's government needs to get it's shit together and fast.

I support our pullout on a timetable if Iraq's government doesn't meet our demands. What I completely disagree with is publicizing such a timetable as it will only embolden the insurgents and the Civil War. It is my hope that Bush has given such a timetable to Iraq. It is also my hope that he follows through with it.