Israel: Elite Humanitarians

[Donkey®]

Originally Posted by article

Israel turns away Darfur refugees

JERUSALEM (CNN) -- Israel on Sunday rejected 50 Africans -- most of them reportedly from Sudan's Darfur region -- who had illegally entered the country from Egypt, a government official said.

The move angered many Israeli lawmakers and human rights advocates because of reports that some Sudanese refugees are being killed or mistreated by authorities in Egypt.

Israel has been struggling with how to cope with an increasing number of Africans, including some from Darfur, who enter the country through Israel's southern border with Egypt.

According to Israel's Haaretz newspaper, the refugees were arrested Friday evening as they tried to cross from Egypt into Israel. They were held at a military base in southern Israel before being driven back to Egypt on Sunday, the newspaper reported.

The nationalities of the 50 sent back Sunday were not released, but the Israeli newspaper Haaretz, citing figures from the Israeli military, said nearly all of them had escaped the genocide in Darfur.

Speaking to CNN, Israeli government spokesman David Baker described them as "economic refugees from Africa."

Baker told The Associated Press that Darfurians would not be immune from Israel's ban on unauthorized immigrants.

Israeli law denies asylum to anyone from an enemy state, AP reports. Sudan's Muslim government is hostile to Israel and has no diplomatic ties with the Jewish state.

Eytan Schwartz, an advocate for Darfur refugees in Israel, told AP that about 400 have entered Israel in recent years. Baker said they would be allowed to live in Israel, and that the ban applied to new arrivals.

Dozens of Israeli lawmakers recently signed a petition urging the government not to deport Sudanese refugees.

Arab militias supported by Sudan's government have committed numerous human rights atrocities, U.N. officials say, including the slaughter and gang rape of civilians, destruction of water sources, looting and burning of buildings and crops.

Earlier this month, Israel's Channel 10 interviewed Israeli soldiers who said they had witnessed Egyptian security officers executing several Darfur refugees.

According to Channel 10, their testimonies were backed up by Israeli military security cameras that showed Egyptian soldiers shooting and killing several asylum-seekers.

Channel 10 did not air the video.

According to Haaretz, one of the asylum-seekers "jumped on the wire fence in an attempt to make it over to the Israeli side, but was reportedly dragged back and bludgeoned to death by the Egyptians."

Responding to the report, Human Rights Watch called on Egypt to investigate the reported deaths.

There has been no public response from the Egyptian government.

An Israeli government official told Reuters that Israel had received "Egyptian commitments" that refugees from Darfur would not be returned to Sudan.

Since the beginning of the year, nearly 3,000 Africans have crossed from Egypt into Israel -- nearly half of them from Sudan, many traveling on foot.

Many Sudanese refugees end up in Israeli prisons waiting for the government to decide what to do with them. Israeli volunteers -- outraged at the incarcerations -- have helped many Sudanese find work in Israel's agricultural communities and temporarily live in family homes across Israel.

"This whole issue of people crossing over from Sinai, people from Africa, to come to Israel is a new issue," Israeli Foreign Ministry spokesman Mark Regev said. "And it's taken a while to get the government to respond correctly." E-mail to a friend E-mail to a friend

So Israel is always right huh? It's their right to turn away whomever they please...detain people sneaking into the country...etc...but rejecting people running from genocide and calling them "economic refugees?" Pathetic.

[SoFlaJDM]

it is pathetic... but you should be careful... you might be labeled an anti-semite because of this

[Darko]

It's their country. If our markets and cafes were bombed on a regular basis we might start watching who we let into the country.

[RMNIXON]

Pathetic that Israel can't find room in their tiny country for every illegal when all of the Islamic Middle East cannot find room for Palestinian Refugees in half a Century?


Here is a Map to help you:

[Dylith]

Originally Posted by RMNIXON

Pathetic that Israel can't find room in their tiny country for every illegal when all of the Islamic Middle East cannot find room for Palestinian Refugees in half a Century?

I fail to see how this has anything to do with Isreal detaining Darfur refugees as "enemy nationals."

Israel is not so small that it cannot accomidate a couple thousand refugees. There is no need to deport these people back to the Sudan, or to Egypt.

[Dylith]

The article I wrote about it back in the begining of July:

Israel: Darfur refugees are “enemy nationals”

Over a thousand refugees from Darfur have fled to Israel seeking safety from genocide and extreme Arab nationalism. These refugees however, have found out that Israel has no place for them. Israel has deemed Darfur refugees “enemy nationals” since they come from the “enemy state” of Sudan.

Sigal Rosen, who works in the department that deals with migrant workers in Israel, has said that: "The government started arresting the Sudanese under the infiltration law - a law made in emergency times; a law under which there was no possibility to release them for a very long period of detention.” Rosen went on to say, "They aren't getting refugee status and there are deportation orders hanging over the heads of all of them.”

In the last two months, over 500 Sudanese refugees have fled to Israel. Israel faces challenges with deporting them back to the Sudan as Israel has no relationship with Sudan. Instead Israel is looking at deporting the refugees to Egypt where they entered Israel from.

A Sudanese refugee named Adam traveled to Israel to seek refuge from the conflict after his family was killed by the Janjaweed. "They [Janjaweed militiamen] came and attacked our village, it was a mass attack. They started burning, killing, and destroying the village and the people with no mercy.”

After arriving in Israel Adam was arrested under the infiltration law and held in prison for 16 months without being charged with a crime. "The situation in prison was very hard. The government said we were an 'enemy nation' and law here for enemy nationals is that they must stay here behind bars, maybe forever." While many have been released after long stays in Israel prison, there are over 100 refugees still behind bars.

Eytan Schwartz, spokesperson for the Committee for Advancement of Refugees of Darfur, explained that Israel fears that such immigrants will compromise its status as a Jewish country. She said “Israel has an identity challenge. We are a Jewish democracy and this is an example, a perfect example, of the negotiation of these two identities.” Schwartz went on to say, "How can you be a democracy with human rights, with values of accepting people from all nations, but you still want to maintain your Jewish identity? ... That means always maintaining a Jewish majority."

Israeli government officials have stated that Israel has its own problem to deal with and cannot be expected to help the Darfur refugees. Avishai Braverman, a Knesset member, states: "People heard that Israel may be a haven ... [But] we are such a small country, we cannot do that. We have our own problems with our own immigrants.”

Schwartz responded to such sentiment by saying "We are a country founded by refugees; we are a people who were persecuted for thousands of years. We of all people should know what its like to be people of a nation that nobody wants to take in.”

[Donkey®]

Originally Posted by RMNIXON

Pathetic that Israel can't find room in their tiny country for every illegal when all of the Islamic Middle East cannot find room for Palestinian Refugees in half a Century?


Here is a Map to help you:


http://wiki.dumpshock.com/images/5/51/MapMiddleEast.gif[/IMG]

So they label them as enemies and can't help them? Awfully forgetful of them. They were refugees themselves from genocide until someone gave them the country they have now.

[Nonphixion]

Speaking to CNN, Israeli government spokesman David Baker described them as "economic refugees from Africa."

are they kidding "economic refugees"

[Joe_Cool]

Originally Posted by Dylith

I fail to see how this has anything to do with Isreal detaining Darfur refugees as "enemy nationals."

Israel is not so small that it cannot accomidate a couple thousand refugees. There is no need to deport these people back to the Sudan, or to Egypt.

Neither are Egypt, Turkey, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Jordan, or Saudi Arabia. But Israel is the bad guy.

[Dylith]

Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

Neither are Egypt, Turkey, Iran, Iraq, Syria, Jordan, or Saudi Arabia. But Israel is the bad guy.

What do they have to do with these Darfur refugees? Care to explain it to me? These people came to Israel seeking refuge from Arab persecution and Israel responded by throwing them in jail.

[Joe_Cool]

Originally Posted by Dylith

What do they have to do with these Darfur refugees? Care to explain it to me? These people came to Israel seeking refuge from Arab persecution and Israel responded by throwing them in jail.

Then I have a question for you. Why did they leave Egypt? If the oppression they were fleeing was in Sudan, then why, once they got to Egypt, did they leave?

[Dylith]

Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

Then I have a question for you. Why did they leave Egypt? If the oppression they were fleeing was in Sudan, then why, once they got to Egypt, did they leave?

Well, let's see, Arabs just got done killing their families. . . Egypt has a large Arab population. . . Israel may be more sympathetic since the Jews experienced genocide as well and are not an Arab dominated country.

You know what, I can't think of any reason at all why they would seek help from Israel.

[Joe_Cool]

Originally Posted by Dylith

Well, let's see, Arabs just got done killing their families. . . Egypt has a large Arab population. . . Israel may be more sympathetic since the Jews experienced genocide as well and are not an Arab dominated country.

You know what, I can't think of any reason at all why they would seek help from Israel.

Was Egypt killing them and their families? Just curious. Why isn't Egypt the bad guy as well for not making them welcome?

In fact, why isn't Sudan the bad guy for allowing it to go on? All these fingers to point, and you (predictably) end up pointing it at Israel.

[Joe_Cool]

For the record, I hope that Israel WILL make them welcome and treat them as refugees, AFTER determining that they aren't a security risk.

But I have to say I'm not surprised at the way you guys demonize them immediately without even considering everything else.

[Nonphixion]

Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

Was Egypt killing them and their families? Just curious. Why isn't Egypt the bad guy as well for not making them welcome?

In fact, why isn't Sudan the bad guy for allowing it to go on? All these fingers to point, and you (predictably) end up pointing it at Israel.

"Earlier this month, Israel's Channel 10 interviewed Israeli soldiers who said they had witnessed Egyptian security officers executing several Darfur refugees."



"According to Channel 10, their testimonies were backed up by Israeli military security cameras that showed Egyptian soldiers shooting and killing several asylum-seekers."



"According to Haaretz, one of the asylum-seekers "jumped on the wire fence in an attempt to make it over to the Israeli side, but was reportedly dragged back and bludgeoned to death by the Egyptians.""

[Dylith]

Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

Was Egypt killing them and their families?

Why should that matter? But to answer your question there has been several incidents of mistreatment of Darfur refugees in Egypt which certainly could prompt other refugees to seek refuge elsewhere, not to mention the fact that those killing them in the Sudan are Arab making it more likely that these people will want to flee to a non-Arab state (hint: they'd feel safer).

Just curious. Why isn't Egypt the bad guy as well for not making them welcome?

They are and have been criticized, but they are no longer threatening to send them back to the Sudan like Israel is. And just because Egypt has had questionable practices with regards to the refugees doesn't mean that Israel doesn't deserve criticism for its actions concerning the matter, which is what this thread is.

The criticism is well deserved.

In fact, why isn't Sudan the bad guy for allowing it to go on?

I don't think that anyone here would argue that Sudan isn't the bad guy when talking about the genocide.

All these fingers to point, and you (predictably) end up pointing it at Israel.

You make the mistake of thinking that they are only being pointed at Israel, which they are not. Israel deserves criticism for its treatment of these asylum seekers. Why not make 100 threads about the Sudan? Because everyone already knows that the Janjaweed is killing people, should I make a thread about a topic that everyone already knows about and that won't generate much, if any, discussion?

This topic isn't as obvious. It is a subject that many people may not hear about in everyday news and one that certainly will generate discussion thus it is more worthy of a thread dedicated to it.

[Joe_Cool]

Ok, fair enough. But the question remains: Is Israel supposed to allow itself to be buried in refugees? You guys like to say that Saddam murdering and raping his people wasn't our problem, so why do Sudan's atrocities become Israel's problem?

Again, I'm sort of playing devil's advocate, and I honestly do hope they can resolve this in a way that helps those people, but honestly, when does enough become enough? Is Israel required to take in all refugees now and forever? They're already mired in a 50 year long conflict with refugees who were rejected by their own people, so I can kind of understand their reluctance to open their gates to more and more.

You're right, though, it's not a simple question. It's a shame that things like this happen at all.

[Dylith]

Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

Ok, fair enough. But the question remains: Is Israel supposed to allow itself to be buried in refugees? You guys like to say that Saddam murdering and raping his people wasn't our problem, so why do Sudan's atrocities become Israel's problem?

Again, I'm sort of playing devil's advocate, and I honestly do hope they can resolve this in a way that helps those people, but honestly, when does enough become enough? Is Israel required to take in all refugees now and forever? They're already mired in a 50 year long conflict with refugees who were rejected by their own people, so I can kind of understand their reluctance to open their gates to more and more.

You're right, though, it's not a simple question. It's a shame that things like this happen at all.

Israel agreed to the Convention Relating to the Status of Refugees and agreed to uphold its principles. Through their current actions some would argue that they are in violation of article three which states: The Contracting States shall apply the provisions of this Convention to refugees without discrimination as to race, religion or country of origin.

Israel was willing to take in tens of thousands of Jewish refugees from Egypt but is unwilling to take in several hundred to a couple thousand non-Jewish refugees who are fleeing genocide.

Israel is also in violation of article 16 of the convention which states:

1. A refugee shall have free access to the courts of law on the territory of all Contracting States.

2. A refugee shall enjoy in the Contracting State in which he has his habitual residence the same treatment as a national in matters pertaining to access to the courts, including legal assistance and exemption from cautio judicatum solvi.

3. A refugee shall be accorded in the matters referred to in paragraph 2 in countries other than that in which he has his habitual residence the treatment granted to a national of the country of his habitual residence.

By detaining these refugees under the Israeli infiltration law and putting them into prison without trial and without being charged of a crime Israel is clearly not allowing these refugees the required legal rights.

Finally, by threatening to deport them back to the Sudan and even to Egypt, Israel is in violation of article 33 of the covenant which states:

No Contracting State shall expel or return ("refouler") a refugee in any manner whatsoever to the frontiers of territories where his life or freedom would be threatened on account of his race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group or political opinion.

[Dylith]

Originally Posted by Joe_Cool

You guys like to say that Saddam murdering and raping his people wasn't our problem, so why do Sudan's atrocities become Israel's problem?

The refugees from Iraq have become other people's problems, more than two million refugees are currently being given shelter in Syria and Jordan and aid through the UN is being given to these countries to help them support the refugees.

Plus, the United States resettles refugees all of the time, we are currently bringing in refugees from southeastern Asia.
100,000 Nepalis who were expelled from Bhutan. (US may not be taking all of them).

They're already mired in a 50 year long conflict with refugees who were rejected by their own people, so I can kind of understand their reluctance to open their gates to more and more.

On a related note to this Israel agreed to allow the Palestinian refugees the right of return. As part of their admitance into the UN Israel agreed to abide by UN resolution 194 as passed by the UN General Assembly, which states: “The General Assembly, Having considered further the situation in Palestine ... Resolves that the refugees wishing to return to their homes and live at peace with their neighbors should be permitted to do so at the earliest practicable date.”

So far Israel has not upheld its end of the deal.