Why Universal Healthcare MUST be mandated

[Thorgrim]

Anyway, why talk about car insurance rather than looking at direct evidence on how health care mandates perform? Other countries — notably Switzerland and the Netherlands — already have such mandates. And guess what? They work.

The second false claim is that people won’t be able to afford the insurance they’re required to have — a claim usually supported with data about how expensive insurance is. But all the Democratic plans include subsidies to lower-income families to help them pay for insurance, plus a promise to increase the subsidies if they prove insufficient.

...

Finally, Mr. Obama is storing up trouble for health reformers by suggesting that there is something nasty about plans that “force every American to buy health care.”

Look, the point of a mandate isn’t to dictate how people should live their lives — it’s to prevent some people from gaming the system. Under the Obama plan, healthy people could choose not to buy insurance, then sign up for it if they developed health problems later. This would lead to higher premiums for everyone else. It would reward the irresponsible, while punishing those who did the right thing and bought insurance while they were healthy.

Here’s an analogy. Suppose someone proposed making the Medicare payroll tax optional: you could choose not to pay the tax during your working years if you didn’t think you’d actually need Medicare when you got older — except that you could change your mind and opt back in if you started to develop health problems.

Can we all agree that this would fatally undermine Medicare’s finances?

For those of you who think "oh, Universal Health, in any form...isn't going to get passed" UHC has pushed in the 1940s, 1950s, 1960s, 1970s, 1990s...if it was executed properly in 1993 we'd have it now, it's getting closer and closer, with a tradition in America of being pushed for...it's inevitable and if you don't believe that you should make another thread on how UHC is never going to get passed...because you'll just be derailing what could be a constructive conversation how we will adjust to Universal Healthcare legislation, and how you want it shaped, etc etc

Now, once Universal Healthcare hits Congress...we have two big decisions...government pays for everyone's insurance on day 1, or we have a multi-phased solution that keeps most insurance in place....conservatives had made it clear the first part won't pass a filibuster (even if the Democrats hit 60, some conservative Democrats like Nelson might not vote for cloture)

So we're onto the current crop of plans offered by Obama, Edwards, Hillary

Now, you have two choices:

1) No Mandate- I'm young, healthy, what do I need healthcare for...if anything really disastrous happens I have family that would take care of me...but chances are I'll be just fine and I'll tough it out on my medical problems...20 something white males with no kids are by far the easiest to go without health insurance

So while the rest of the country is dealing with increased costs, I'll be sitting at a restaurant ordering my third piece of chocolate cake, smoking a cigarette, and pounding alcohol...perhaps ill pop some black market vicodin, or smoke a bowl ontop of that

Now, when I turn 50, and I have lung cancer, liver disease, cardiovascular problems...oh fuck, time to sign up for the government plan! Yes...I'm saved, and YOU have to pay for ALL of it...I never had to pay a god damn cent my whole life for healthcare, now you have to pay for all of it

2) Mandate- I'm forced to pay...another government program I have to be involved with (for sake of argument I think it's fair to say I'm forced into the student loan program)

Not only that, it costs me money, and healthcare providers have been known to reward you for being in excellent health

Fuck, I just lost my job, now I'm struggling and the government is forcing me to pay for healthcare? Well unlike driver's insurance, where I'd be fucked, now I can get government benefits so that my healthcare is paid for...and only my healthcare, until I get back on my feet

No one wants to live in poverty, and have so little wealth that they qualify for 100% subsidies...I get another job, this one is decent, but oh no, now I have to pay for all that health insurance! Not so...subsidies still exist, only for part of it though, as I'm making enough money that I can live triple or so above the poverty rate and still have decent money for insurance

Wouldn't you know it, in a few years I get some nice raises, and I can pay for all my healthcare, as is everyone else who isn't in poverty...everyone is paying...costs are kept down...I even pick to go with Blue Cross instead of the government program, the prices have basically evened out, and I like their interactive website better than the governments



Which is the better system? Discuss

If that fails, note that the "Holy Roman Empire" of the 11th century was neither "Holy" nor "Roman" nor an "Empire" and discuss

[Thorgrim]

The Mandate Muddle

[Ardentfrost]

Where did your op-ed come from? There's no link

[Thorgrim]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Where did your op-ed come from? There's no link

Now there is, something is screwy with LL and IE...

[motivez]

If we're going to have a Universal Healthcare system, it has to be a mandated tax that you can't opt out of and then jump in later after avoiding paying for it all those years you were healthy.. It would make it financially unstable and probably lead to solvency problems, similar to social security..

I'm pretty sure America is ready for such a system after having to deal with the bullshit prices of the current system, and since I think it's likely we're going to have one and will ultimately have to decide which I like the best / hate the least.. I can't say I support Obama's plan as it is.