Why shouldn't law-abiding citizens be allowed to own whatever firearms they desire? - Page 2

archangel003 · 09-05-2006, 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

Washington's acts PROVED that even the best government can be oppresive.

There was nothing oppressive about the spirits tax.

Scrum · 09-05-2006, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by ballz2wallz

this thread is about the OP, not the second amendment. allow me to refer you back to the OP:

if you want to make posts about the second amendment, perhaps ask him what he thinks about the second amendment, or make a separate thread about it? but you can't answer his question with something off topic.

Thanks champ.

Lets discuss the right of individuals to own weapons without talking about the 2nd amendment.

Oh look, others are talking about the 2nd in this thread. Perhaps you should make a post telling them to stay on subject?

Scrum · 09-05-2006, 11:56 AM

Originally Posted by archangel003

Let's stop throwing the nuclear red-herring around, also.

We're talking about firearms here, nuclear arms weren't around in 1776, and they're the genie we should have left in the bottle.

So everyone should be able to own black-powder weapons since that's what was around in 1776.

archangel003 · 09-05-2006, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by Scrumtralecent

So everyone should be able to own black-powder weapons since that's what was around in 1776.

I would agree with you if the US military and government agents still carried flintlock muskets around. But that's not the case.

SpicyMcVoodoo · 09-05-2006, 01:13 PM

Because there's a point at which a firearm is so powerful that its utility as a hunting/personal defense weapon doesn't get any higher, but its utility as a weapon for crime does.

In other words, a law abiding citizen should never have to complain that he cannot legally own a weapon which would allow him to responsibly defend himself most effectively. Fighting off the government is not responsibly defending yourself. It also doesn't make any sense because you're not going to defeat the government no matter how many machine guns you have...all you'll do is kill a bunch of people like the LA bank robbers.

You might say, well, what does it matter if the weapon only goes to law abiding citizens? It matters because if you take away the market for overkill guns, then they won't be manufactured and eventually trickle down to the black market where criminals get them.

Thorgrim · 09-05-2006, 01:21 PM

Originally Posted by archangel003

I would agree with you if the US military and government agents still carried flintlock muskets around. But that's not the case.

Now they carry miniguns and bazookas

instead of a crazy person killing 2-3 people in a shooting, now he'd mow down doezns and explode a few more dozen...excellent

I mean, look how good its going in Iraq where everyone has whatever weapon they want!

DosEquis · 09-05-2006, 01:25 PM

I do not agree with some one in the general public being able to arm themselves better than one police man or one military person. Automatic weapons and assault rifles should not be available to standard civilians. There is a reason why the military and police choose some weapons over others regardless of the caliber.

If there is 3 people vs. 1 policeman then he is obviously fucked. But 1v1 the cop should have the advantage. Not only should he be better trained, but should have the better gun.

Diesel66 · 09-05-2006, 01:29 PM

Originally Posted by archangel003

There was nothing oppressive about the spirits tax.

Using the Army to squash them though ?

Originally Posted by Scrumtralecent

So everyone should be able to own black-powder weapons since that's what was around in 1776.

Except the public had better weapons then the average Soldier.

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

Now they carry miniguns and bazookas

instead of a crazy person killing 2-3 people in a shooting, now he'd mow down dozens and explode a few more dozen...excellent

You guys ignore the fact that everyone else would be armed, and that guy would be shot immediately.

I mean, look how good its going in Iraq where everyone has whatever weapon they want!

Almost all the deaths in Iraq are from explosives

Ardentfrost · 09-05-2006, 01:38 PM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

I mean, look how good its going in Iraq where everyone has whatever weapon they want!

Yeah, they're trying to stop oppression. If someone invaded us like that, wouldn't you want people to be armed enough to fight them?

Thorgrim · 09-05-2006, 01:40 PM

yeah, those explosives are abducting people and drilling holes in their head, and those snipers, well the explosions drove the civilians into their bullets

beez · 09-05-2006, 01:46 PM

Citizens should be able to be armed at least as well as the military. After all, the citizenry may have to fight with the military at some point.

Ardentfrost · 09-05-2006, 01:48 PM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

yeah, those explosives are abducting people and drilling holes in their head, and those snipers, well the explosions drove the civilians into their bullets

Wait, wtf are you talking about. Weren't you talking about the citizens of Iraq being armed? And I said they're trying to throw off the oppressive shackles of a controlling government they don't want.

Thorgrim · 09-05-2006, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by beez

Citizens should be able to be armed at least as well as the military. After all, the citizenry may have to fight with the military at some point.

I demand an air craft carrier!

Thorgrim · 09-05-2006, 01:52 PM

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Wait, wtf are you talking about. Weren't you talking about the citizens of Iraq being armed? And I said they're trying to throw off the oppressive shackles of a controlling government they don't want.

i was refering to someone elses post about it being all "explosions"

beez · 09-05-2006, 02:05 PM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

I demand an air craft carrier!

More than you can afford, pal

TheScatman · 09-05-2006, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

because the general public is stupid and irresponsible.

so why let all these people vote?

TheScatman · 09-05-2006, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by beez

Citizens should be able to be armed at least as well as the military. After all, the citizenry may have to fight with the military at some point.

Donkey® · 09-05-2006, 02:27 PM

So let me get this straight...we should be allowed to arm ourselves with ANYTHING that is shot with gunpowder? 155MM artillery? Or is it we should be allowed to have whatever the government has? So F22s should be allowed? Do you idiots realize how stupid that sounds?

Ardentfrost · 09-05-2006, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

So let me get this straight...we should be allowed to arm ourselves with ANYTHING that is shot with gunpowder? 155MM artillery? Or is it we should be allowed to have whatever the government has? So F22s should be allowed? Do you idiots realize how stupid that sounds?

You afraid crime will start to be committed using F22's? Or the future Columbines will happen with tanks?