Why do people hate Jews?

[Thorgrim]

Originally Posted by RockPusher

But your whole argument is a BLATANT LOGICAL FALLACY and you lack the clarity of vision to see it!

You are so passionate in defending the SANCTIFIED but incomplete version of history from ANY divergent examination - EVEN EXAMINATION THAT EXPANDS the understand vs. revising it, that you have lost objectivity.

Your logical fallacy is in thinking that the two proposed motives are mutually exclusive, and they are not!

Yes... the Germans were really mean and most certainly targeted the Jews within their territory. That does not mean that they were not equally mean to ALL OTHER OPPOSITION GROUPS - including the POLISH RACE, communists, The White Rose, etc. ad nauseum.

Take off those coke bottle lenses Thorgrim, your myopia is hiding the big picture from you.

The NAZI PRIME motive had 0% to do with race! They destroyed all who opposed their radical corporate Socialism.

Saying the Nazis had a jewish final solution is not a logical fallacy, however, changing the argument, like you did there, is...

Okay, So you admit, there was a final solution to sterlize all people under the Nazis with Jewish blood, and kill all those they designated or found out were Jews...ALL OF THEM, EXTERMINATED

Now, find me some documents that show the Germans had a clear plan to sterilize all partial Slavs, and kill every Slav, not even a single person left for labor, or anyone with any Slav-blood left in the entire German Nazi Empire in a generation

I'm waiting

[Spideynw]

Why is this thread still going? No one has shown any proof that there are a significant number of people who hate Jews.

[A-1 Sauce]

They killed our lord !::in best House impression::

[RMNIXON]

Originally Posted by Spideynw

Why is this thread still going? No one has shown any proof that there are a significant number of people who hate Jews.

Your point is well taken, but I had to post this anyway!

[7960]

Originally Posted by RMNIXON

Your point is well taken, but I had to post this anyway!

"image stolen from..." ?

[bheld]

Somebody bought into the Republican Noise Machine and read "Liberal Fascism." I'm glad you're reading, but...

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Spideynw

Why is this thread still going? No one has shown any proof that there are a significant number of people who hate Jews.

There is still discrimination against the Jews the same as there's discrimination against other minority groups.

[Spideynw]

Originally Posted by JaJae

There is still discrimination against the Jews the same as there's discrimination against other minority groups.

This is why I said no one has shown that there are a significant number of people who hate Jews. Look at the backlash that happened when people found out he was anti-semitic.

Maybe it is just that I live in Utah, but I have never met anyone that is an anti-semite.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Spideynw

This is why I said no one has shown that there are a significant number of people who hate Jews. Look at the backlash that happened when people found out he was anti-semitic.

Maybe it is just that I live in Utah, but I have never met anyone that is an anti-semite.

Define significant? There's a decent number of anti-semitic people in this country. More than there should be.

[JaJae]

Here's more..

Apparently, in the modern world, so determined to live by the bomb, this is an alien concept. You don't befriend anyone, you dominate them. We have created a culture of violence (Israel and the Jews are the biggest players) and that Culture of Violence is eventually going to destroy humanity.

Arun Gandhi: OnFaith on washingtonpost.com

This stuff isn't rare believe it or not. If you're willing to look for it you can find this is more common than it might seem.

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by JaJae

Here's more..

Arun Gandhi: OnFaith on washingtonpost.com

This stuff isn't rare believe it or not. If you're willing to look for it you can find this is more common than it might seem.

That's not an anti-semitic statement.

He's placing blame because of actions, not just some stereotype.


I really hate that any time Israel is criticized for it's actions, it's automatically dismissed because the person is obviously an anti-semite.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Scrum

That's not an anti-semitic statement.

He's placing blame because of actions, not just some stereotype.


I really hate that any time Israel is criticized for it's actions, it's automatically dismissed because the person is obviously an anti-semite.

He's saying the Jews are destroying the world's humanity. How is that not anti-semitic? The WP even apologized for releasing the words calling them anti-semitic, not something they do lightly.

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by JaJae

He's saying the Jews are destroying the world's humanity. How is that not anti-semitic?

"We have created a culture of violence (Israel and the Jews are the biggest players) and that Culture of Violence is eventually going to destroy humanity."

He only says they are the biggest players in something that will destroy humanity. That's a far cry from saying that Jews are destroying humanity and it's definitely not just making a judgment based on a stereotype. He's making a statement based on Israels actions.

Originally Posted by JaJae

The WP even apologized for releasing the words calling them anti-semitic, not something they do lightly.

People apologize for un-PC speech all the time.

I remember people defending Imus and CBS issued an apology. Does that automatically make Imus's comments racist?

[RockPusher]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

Now, find me some documents that show the Germans had a clear plan to sterilize all partial Slavs, and kill every Slav, not even a single person left for labor, or anyone with any Slav-blood left in the entire German Nazi Empire in a generation

I'm waiting

(Below find links to info on other groups targeted for extermination and sterilization. There are so many and it is so well documented that I am surprised you need help to find info)

The NAZIs party can be said to HATE and be RACIST only in an anthropomorphic sense. The NAZI party was a large union/corporation, and as such, not capable of emotion. You have to erect an effigy like Hitler or Goebbels to personify the cold and methodical nature of the NAZI machine as racist.

What you fail to understand about the NAZIs is that their racialism was little more than a tool of government used to justify itself. Socialism works by galvanizing the support of the largest identifiable group(s) by appealing to their desire to benefit as a special interest.

The NAZI machine was the poster child for pure Socialism because it had the perfect special interest group to propel it to power.. i.e. the productive working class. The German people's big sins were their collectivist mentality and lack of vision. They assimilated into one big group on the basis of ethnicity. They believed the message. No ethnicity other than Germanic was viewed as any different from the others in that they were all enemies.

The Germans were not "evil". They were radical socialists. Their work was the work of socialism, not some black side of man's character. Where democracy seeks to make all people equal in liberty, socialism seeks to make all people equal in servitude. You see it written all over 20th century history. 100 million killed in its name.

WikiAnswers - Did Hitler only kill Jews

Did Hitler only kill Jews?


Answer

No, he systematically killed other groups.

from Wikipedia

Millions of other minority members also perished in the Holocaust. About 220,000 Sinti and Roma were murdered (some estimates are as high as 800,000) between a quarter to a half of their European population. Other groups deemed by the Nazis to be "racially inferior" or "undesirable" included Poles (6 million killed, of whom 3 million were Christian, and the rest Jewish), Serbs (estimates vary between 500,000 and 1.2 million killed, mostly by Croat Usta e), around 500,000 Bosniaks[10], Soviet military prisoners of war and civilians in occupied territories including Russians and other East Slavs, the mentally or physically disabled, homosexuals, Africans, Jehovah's Witnesses, Communists and political dissidents, trade unionists, Freemasons, Eastern Christians, and Catholic and Protestant clergy, were also persecuted and killed.

Many others where also killed in the wars that Hitler started.

(note: Hitler did not necessarily personally kill people in all these groups)


Hitler: The Pathology of Evil - Google Book Search

Compulsory sterilization - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[Thorgrim]

Okay, so there were millions of Roma, the Nazis killed 200,000...they were really close to exterminated them...

Again, no documentation they had any plans on them, while they rushed at breakneak spead to import Russian Jews from the frontlines back to Poland to the gas chambers

There are documents after documents on the "final solution" to "the jewish question" but all you have to show is that wikipedia tells you a lot of stuff about Nazis...

I asked you for documentation, you give me wikipedia when I give you physical documents that are verified around the world, by Germans and by Nazis...where was the conference where they decided to sterilize all Germans who had a grandparents who was Romanian (and thus a Slav), no matter how loyal?

Over a million Jews died at Auschwitz, less than a hundred thousand non-Jewish Poles died at Auschwitz...and the camp was in Poland...that shows you EXACTLY where their priorities were...

Look at the Nuremburg Laws, look at the Nazi conferences, look at the way they treated WW1 veterans with the Iron Cross, a full blooded German was treated as the highest Hero if he had such a distinguished background, a Jewish German? Whisked away to a ghetto death, if not murdered outright, what other ethnic group in Germany was treated like that? I haven't found one group systematically treated like that

It's been shown time and time again you have done no research on the Nazis, you're unwilling to look up source documents, and the only thing you are interested in is finding someone to make a wikipedia entry favorable to you (which they're not) or using google until you find some writing on the internet favorable to you (internet is a big place)

Even though it's perfectly clear to anyone with knowledge on world war 2 that you are obviously being a troll, taking a course on the Nazis or even reading a few books about them is not mandatory to participate in this forum, so you can claim ignorance until you break the rules, however the ignore feature will prevent me from being bothered by your posts

[RockPusher]

You are a testament to public education. So wrapped up in your redacted history that you actually feel like you are being personally attacked when somebody threatens you with information that you have not considered.

Why is it so hard for you to tolerate the notion that the motives of the Nazi government was the cold, premeditated, and systematic destruction of all of its enemies vs an irrational blinding hatred. You COMPLETELY disregard the brutal nature of their system government by holding up the "evil, illogical racist" effigy up as the scapegoat. In doing so, you would blindly follow down their path while patting yourself on your back.

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

Okay, so there were millions of Roma, the Nazis killed 200,000...they were really close to exterminated them...

You sound like a true racist. You dismiss the slaughter of millions of Roma, Polak, Serb, Croat etc because their lives are not as valuable to you as your chosen martyrs.

There are documents after documents on the "final solution" to "the jewish question" but all you have to show is that wikipedia tells you a lot of stuff about Nazis...

Sorry, I don't carry around primary historical sources for your approval. I can give you some links to documents citing well known events and speeches, but you will claim to require yet more unreasonable standards for information because the info does not fit your agenda.

Secondary source (Hitlers Obersalzberg speech) (Actual document scan on OMG wikipedia) Why wiki??? easy to access common info to spoonfeed lazy people with.



Our strength consists in our speed and in our brutality. Genghis Khan led millions of women and children to slaughter—with premeditation and a happy heart. History sees in him solely the founder of a state. It’s a matter of indifference to me what a weak western European civilization will say about me. I have issued the command—and I’ll have anybody who utters but one word of criticism executed by a firing squad—that our war aim does not consist in reaching certain lines, but in the physical destruction of the enemy. Accordingly, I have placed my death-head formation in readiness—for the present only in the East—with orders to them to send to death mercilessly and without compassion, men, women, and children of Polish derivation and language. Only thus shall we gain the living space () which we need. Who, after all, speaks to-day of the annihilation of the Armenians? (p. 11–12)

Over a million Jews died at Auschwitz, less than a hundred thousand non-Jewish Poles died at Auschwitz...and the camp was in Poland...that shows you EXACTLY where their priorities were...

Ohhhh.... so if they didn't die at Auschwitz then you don't give a crap huh? over 3 million Polaks and Kulaks murdered, but to you, it didn't happen. I am become more and more convinced that you are a racist. A vile sort of racist at that. So complete is your racism, that you will ACTUALLY DENY the "Holocaust" of millions of Polish people, only acknowledging your race of fixation. Poland ITSELF was a death camp. And you dare to malign MY understanding of history!?

Even though it's perfectly clear to anyone with knowledge on world war 2 that you are obviously being a troll, taking a course on the Nazis or even reading a few books about them is not mandatory to participate in this forum, so you can claim ignorance until you break the rules, however the ignore feature will prevent me from being bothered by your posts

You most certainly suffer from the Dunning kruger effect. You can WIKI that if you like.

[crazyfacedjenkins]

Originally Posted by RockPusher

That is HIGHLY debatable. There is no known Nazi program to extinct the Jewish people. The official programs were stated as EXTERMINATION. Of course there were Germans who wished all Jews dead, that does not make it an official program. Some Jews wished all Germans dead. Some whites wished all blacks dead.... but that does not make official gov. policy.

Until recently, the definition of exterminate was to expel, to get rid of, to move outside or beyond (EX) the boundary (TERMINUS). The word LITERALLY means to remove.

The early Nazi programs coerced the Jews to leave. The German claim of gently encouraging them to leave is bullshit as crystal nacht (night of broken glass) clearly demonstrated. They were forced to leave, and most did flee. It was the poor Jews who predominately stayed behind. The Germans did offer to transport the remainder out, but most were afraid to come forward to get on the first trains. The next trains sent them to internment camps.

If the Nazis intended to commit genocide, it is not reflected in their policies.

That does not mean that they were not responsible for millions of deaths, but let us have a clear understanding of the events of the past so that we can better understand the present.

I had to sign up because I couldn't help comment on this. I really don't understand when people debate that the Nazis didn't want to exterminate the Jews. My grandfather fought for Germany in WWII and let me tell you, they wanted ALL of them dead. Everyone knew it, and most of that generation still to this day really hate Jews.

[JaJae]

Welcome to the forum

[crazyfacedjenkins]

I suppose your argument was that the government didn't have specific programs, but I don't know about that. For god's sake my grandfather met Hitler and I'm pretty sure they were all in agreement with ending the Jewish race.