Feeling kinda disheartened

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 11:24 AM

For some of you this will be a chance to jeer, but I figure I can't be the only one that is disheartened by this whole election.

I really feel that people have chosen McCain as the current frontrunner simply because of fallacious arguments, complete misconceptions, etc. I remember reading that a large percentage of these folks were supposedly undecided even going into the polls, and I don't understand how you could seriously be undecided if you paid any attention at all. That begs the question - if they weren't paying any attention at all, why did they eventually choose to vote for him? FFS!

I heard on the radio someone saying that he's really excited because for the first time ever the entire field of candidates aren't horrible, in fact they are all great (he was referring to D & R both) and he said he could vote for any of them and still be happy. wtf?!

I know a woman who already cast her absentee ballot for Hillary. A buddy asked her what lead her to vote for Hillary, and she answered that she doesn't really agree with everything Hillary wants (not that this woman could have named any of Hillary's issues) but that "us women gotta stick together".

That's right, she voted for Hillary solely because Hillary allegedly has a vagina.

On saturday, I'm going to be running my precinct's caucus, and am an automatic delegate to the county convention. I'm going to go there, we're going to elect the second delegate who might even end up being a RP supporter (the area around me is chock full of them), and we're going to go to the county convention and be completely ignored.

Some of you may be thinking I'm a sore loser or eating sour grapes (I am, I guess), but that's not the intention of this thread. I guess I want to complain a little, look at lessons learned, and pick it up and move on.

Thorgrim · 02-06-2008, 11:36 AM

You know, democrats have been elected a lot of "new generation" Democrats...people like Jim Webb, Jon Tester...there is a chance they may just get it right...just because the GOP revolution failed doesn't mean a Democratic revolution HAS to fail

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

You know, democrats have been elected a lot of "new generation" Democrats...people like Jim Webb, Jon Tester...there is a chance they may just get it right...just because the GOP revolution failed doesn't mean a Democratic revolution HAS to fail

Too bad none of them are running for president

Grouch · 02-06-2008, 11:58 AM

Don't forget all those wasted votes for Huckabee and Paul that sure helped McCain rather than Romney.

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 12:00 PM

Originally Posted by Grouch

Don't forget all those wasted votes for Huckabee and Paul that sure helped McCain rather than Romney.

Who cares? They are no different in my eyes.

Grouch · 02-06-2008, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by thewise1

Who cares? They are no different in my eyes.

Then you should get your eyes checked and pay more attention to the issues.

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 12:08 PM

Originally Posted by Grouch

Then you should get your eyes checked and pay more attention to the issues.

k

Grouch · 02-06-2008, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by thewise1

k

Well, looks like you're no better than your retarded woman friend.

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 12:15 PM

Originally Posted by Grouch

Well, looks like you're no better than your retarded woman friend.

Oh

I guess it has nothing to do with the fact that both want to continue our stupid war on terror, continue unsound economic policies, and continue to diminish liberty here at home in the name of safety. I guess somehow you've accepted the inevitability of these actions and have now begun to hope that you can negotiate HOW it's done instead of whether it's done.

Apparently that's enough reason to vote for romney over mccain or vice versa, depending who you are.

Grouch · 02-06-2008, 12:25 PM

Originally Posted by thewise1

Oh

I guess it has nothing to do with the fact that both want to continue our stupid war on terror, continue unsound economic policies, and continue to diminish liberty here at home in the name of safety. I guess somehow you've accepted the inevitability of these actions and have now begun to hope that you can negotiate HOW it's done instead of whether it's done.

Apparently that's enough reason to vote for romney over mccain or vice versa, depending who you are.

Yeah pretty much. Since with the current political field and the reality of American politics, Paul never had a chance nor will anyone like Paul have a chance in the foreseeable future.

You need to work with reality, not with wishful thinking.

Its very disturbing, but America is on a crash course with socialism, without an armed rebelion (which will never happen, ever) there is nothing we can to do stop it. The media wants it, the people in power want it (on both sides) and the people want it as seen by recent elections. In reality it is inevitable. So I am I doing my best to slow it or steer it in a more hospitable direction.

Ardentfrost · 02-06-2008, 12:27 PM

So, you support socialism as long as the version of socialism implemented aligns with your personal views.

Got it.

Grouch · 02-06-2008, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

So, you support socialism as long as the version of socialism implemented aligns with your personal views.

Got it.

No, I see the inevitability and reality that more people in this nation want socialism than don't. And I know that the people of this nation that do not want it, do not have the balls or the means to have an armed revolution. All you have is your lip service to a failing cause.

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 12:37 PM

Originally Posted by Grouch

No, I see the inevitability and reality that more people in this nation want socialism than don't. And I know that the people of this nation that do not want it, do not have the balls or the means to have an armed revolution. All you have is your lip service to a failing cause.

Every time you compromise with socialism, you lose a bit of personal liberty and you will NEVER get it back as long as you continue compromising.

Thus, I choose not to compromise at all. Better that the country should fall into complete socialism and fail so that those of us who want nothing to do with it can pick up the pieces than to continue giving our permission to be raped for the benefit of those who choose not to produce.

Thorgrim · 02-06-2008, 12:43 PM

You know...England, France, Germany, even Sweden...they aren't exactly collapsing...and countries with far more radical policies...India...China...are looking like they are going to surpass us as world leaders...

Ardentfrost · 02-06-2008, 12:47 PM

Those countries aren't us. And likewise, I'm sure there are people like us that live in those countries that never wanted it and still don't. I will remain one of those people because even if everyone in the US accepts the forced good naturedness and are willing to work to provide for everyone else thereby making the system work flawlessly, mine and everyone else's freedoms are still being stripped away.

I can never support that.

Thorgrim · 02-06-2008, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Those countries aren't us. And likewise, I'm sure there are people like us that live in those countries that never wanted it and still don't. I will remain one of those people because even if everyone in the US accepts the forced good naturedness and are willing to work to provide for everyone else thereby making the system work flawlessly, mine and everyone else's freedoms are still being stripped away.

I can never support that.

If you guys are going to sit here and complain because Americans are never going to want a government that barely exists (In fact, given the chance, a constitutional convention of 2008 would radically expand the government AND our POSITIVE rights)

There are muslims who complaining because it doesn't look like an Islamic Caliphate will rule the world

Both of you guys, and other unrealistic groups, need to move on and offer more than just criticisms

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 12:58 PM

I'm offering everything I physically can, thorgrim.

I donated money.
I canvassed.
I became a precinct committee officer.
I will try to go to the state convention as a delegate, but will likely fail (being realistic)

I write my state reps/senator constantly to the point that they know me on a first name basis and are calling me to discuss my letters and such.
I write my US reps/senators constantly, although they just send me cut and paste replies, of course.

Don't give me this 'offering just criticisms' crap. If you have more suggestions, I'd love to hear them.

I don't want your socialism and never will. Demanding that I support those who choose not to produce just because I do produce is wrong, plain and simple.

Ardentfrost · 02-06-2008, 12:59 PM

We offer realistic solutions all the time. This thread is about the sad state of politics (and political direction) in America, though. Our realistic solutions (like, for instance, the scaling back of 50 years worth of executive orders building the size of the executive branch) will never become a reality, despite how reasonable they are, because of the issues approached in this thread. People don't WANT to give up their bullshit "protections" like Homeland Security because they think it is somehow protecting them from Ahmed. People WANT to give up their freedoms.

That doesn't mean we have to roll over and accept it, and if that's what you're looking for, I'll point out that you haven't rolled over and accepted the changes over that past 8 years that are unlikely to ever be repealed.

Thorgrim · 02-06-2008, 01:26 PM

the state of politics weren't much better in the 1850s when the country was far more "libertarian" it was actually worse, it was corrupt as hell, and not silly earmarks, just straight bribery of politicians and judges...

Today, federal agencies like the FBI crack down on corrupt judges

thewise1 · 02-06-2008, 01:43 PM

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

the state of politics weren't much better in the 1850s when the country was far more "libertarian" it was actually worse, it was corrupt as hell, and not silly earmarks, just straight bribery of politicians and judges...

Today, federal agencies like the FBI crack down on corrupt judges

objection, relevance