Berkeley v Marines

[7960]

Originally Posted by Scrum

Yeah, having the military use violence against citizens would surly clear this up.

Just a few rifle butts to some heads... I'll be honest, I'd laugh.

[kinggovernor]

Originally Posted by 7960

In this case, I disagree. They should be putting the smackdown on the protesters.

we do traing for crowd control: Marine Corps News -> Marines learn new ways to be ‘non-lethal’

but it would much more physical than a regular police force would do. I don't think that we should use these tactics against US citizens unless there was a riot that the police couldn't handle like the LA riots where we were involved.

[kinggovernor]

Originally Posted by bheld

Maybe they can call Blackwater.

why would they call blackwater?

[bheld]

Originally Posted by kinggovernor

well it is a video of protestors dressed in orange jumpsuits physically blocking access to people trying to get in and out of the building.

Okay, well then I wouldn't condone that.

[bheld]

Originally Posted by kinggovernor

why would they call blackwater?

Security is kind of their thing, you know? We haven't really tossed them many bones lately. They could use a million dollar pick-me-up. I hear Erik Prince almost had to sell one of his mansions.

[kinggovernor]

now state GOP lawmakers are trying to get funding cut to Berkeley to include:

Programs facing cuts, under the federal proposals, include $243,000 for the Chez Panisse Foundation to provide organic school lunches to Berkeley schools. Another $1 million is earmarked for University of California, Berkeley to create a new endowment and catalog congressional papers.

The College President has come out against the City Council:

In an effort to forestall the cuts, UC Berkeley Chancellor Robert Birgeneau sent a letter Tuesday to 52 lawmakers in Washington to stressing that the university has no connection to actions taken by the Berkeley council.

Birgeneau called the council proposals "ill advised, intemperate and hurtful, particularly to the young men and women and their families who are sacrificing so much for our country."

everyone likes federal and state funding

San Jose Mercury News - Lawmakers won't back down following Berkeley council's vote retracting statement to U.S. Marine recruiters

[RMNIXON]

Originally Posted by bheld

Harassment happens on a daily basis there. It's free speech, although the hate is a little stronger toward the patrons of a clinic than potential military recruits.

I thought the law was rather clear that such protests could not block a facility, and I agree with that by the way. So what is different in this case?

As for your measure of hate I think that rather subjective on your part. Plenty of it displayed by fanatics on the right and left. I don't make excuses for either.

[kinggovernor]

Commentary: An Open Letter to Code Pink

While the protest that you staged in front of my office on Wednesday, Sept. 26th, was an exercise of your constitutional rights, the messages that you left behind were insulting, untrue, and ultimately misdirected. Additionally, from the comments quoted in the Berkeley Daily Planet article, it is clear that you have no idea what it is that I do here. Given that I was unaware of your planned protest, I was unable to contest your claims in person, so I will therefore address them here.

First, a little bit about who I am: I am a Marine captain with over eight years of service as a commissioned officer. I flew transport helicopters for most of my time in the Marine Corps before requesting orders to come here. Currently, I am the officer selection officer for the northern Bay Area. My job is to recruit, interview, screen, and evaluate college students and college graduates that show an interest in becoming officers in the Marine Corps. Once they’ve committed to pursuing this program, I help them apply, and if selected, I help them prepare for the rigors of Officer Candidate School and for the challenges of life as a Marine officer. To be eligible for my programs, you have to be either a full-time college student or a college graduate. I don’t pull anyone out of school, and high school students are not eligible.

I moved my office to Berkeley in December of last year. Previously, it was located in an old federal building in Alameda. That building was due to be torn down and I had to find a new location. I choose our new site because of its proximity to UC Berkeley and to the BART station. Most of the candidates in my program either go to Cal or to one of the schools in San Francisco, the East Bay, or the North Bay. Logistically, the Shattuck Square location was the most convenient for them.

Next, you claim that I lie. I have never, and will never, lie to any individual that shows an interest in my programs. I am upfront with everything that is involved at every step of the way and I go out of my way to ensure that they know what to expect when they apply. I tell them that this is not an easy path. I tell them that leading Marines requires a great deal of self-sacrifice. I tell them that, should they succeed in their quest to become a Marine officer, they will almost certainly go to Iraq. In the future, if you plan to attack my integrity, please have the courtesy to explain to me specifically the instances in which you think that I lied.

Next, scrawled across the doorway to my office, you wrote, “Recruiters are Traitors.” Please explain this one. How exactly am I a traitor? Was I a traitor when I joined the Marine Corps all those years ago? Is every Marine, therefore, a traitor? Was I a traitor during my two stints in Iraq? Was I a traitor when I was delivering humanitarian aid to the victims of the tsunami in Sumatra? Or do you only consider me a traitor while I am on this job? The fact is, recruitment is and always has been a part of maintaining any military organization. In fact, recruitment is a necessity of any large organization. Large corporations have employees that recruit full-time. Even you, I’m sure, must expend some effort to recruit for Code Pink. So what, exactly, is it that makes me a traitor?

The fact is this: any independent nation must maintain a military (or be allied with those who do) to ensure the safety and security of its citizens. Regardless of what your opinions are of the current administration or the current conflict in Iraq, the U.S. military will be needed again in the future. If your counter-recruitment efforts are ultimately successful, who will defend us if we are directly attacked again as we were at Pearl Harbor? Who would respond if a future terrorist attack targets the Golden Gate Bridge, the BART system, or the UC Berkeley clock tower? And, to address the most hypocritical stance that your organization takes on its website, where would the peace keeping force come from that you advocate sending to Darfur?

Finally, I believe that your efforts in protesting my office are misdirected. I agree that your stated goals of peace and social justice are worthy ones. War is a terrible thing that should only be undertaken in the most dire, extreme, and necessary of circumstances. However, war is made by politicians. The conflict in Iraq was ordered by the president and authorized by Congress. They are the ones who have the power to change the policy in Iraq, not members of the military. We execute policy to the best of our ability and to the best of our human capacity. Protesting in front of my office may be an easy way to get your organization in the headlines of local papers, but it doesn’t further any of your stated goals.

To conclude, I don’t consider myself a “recruiter.” I am a Marine who happens to be on recruiting duty. As such, I conduct myself in accordance with our core values of honor, courage, and commitment. I will never sacrifice my honor by lying to anyone that walks into my office. I will never forsake the courage that it takes to restrain myself in the face of insulting and libelous labels like liar and traitor. And, most importantly, I will never waver from my commitment to helping individuals who desire to serve their country as officers in the Marine Corps.



Captain Richard Lund is the United States Marine Corps’ officer selection officer for the northern Bay Area.

Berkeley Daily Planet

[Stylerod]

Originally Posted by kinggovernor

Commentary: An Open Letter to Code Pink

While the protest that you staged in front of my office on Wednesday, Sept. 26th, was an exercise of your constitutional rights, the messages that you left behind were insulting, untrue, and ultimately misdirected. Additionally, from the comments quoted in the Berkeley Daily Planet article, it is clear that you have no idea what it is that I do here. Given that I was unaware of your planned protest, I was unable to contest your claims in person, so I will therefore address them here.

First, a little bit about who I am: I am a Marine captain with over eight years of service as a commissioned officer. I flew transport helicopters for most of my time in the Marine Corps before requesting orders to come here. Currently, I am the officer selection officer for the northern Bay Area. My job is to recruit, interview, screen, and evaluate college students and college graduates that show an interest in becoming officers in the Marine Corps. Once they’ve committed to pursuing this program, I help them apply, and if selected, I help them prepare for the rigors of Officer Candidate School and for the challenges of life as a Marine officer. To be eligible for my programs, you have to be either a full-time college student or a college graduate. I don’t pull anyone out of school, and high school students are not eligible.

I moved my office to Berkeley in December of last year. Previously, it was located in an old federal building in Alameda. That building was due to be torn down and I had to find a new location. I choose our new site because of its proximity to UC Berkeley and to the BART station. Most of the candidates in my program either go to Cal or to one of the schools in San Francisco, the East Bay, or the North Bay. Logistically, the Shattuck Square location was the most convenient for them.

Next, you claim that I lie. I have never, and will never, lie to any individual that shows an interest in my programs. I am upfront with everything that is involved at every step of the way and I go out of my way to ensure that they know what to expect when they apply. I tell them that this is not an easy path. I tell them that leading Marines requires a great deal of self-sacrifice. I tell them that, should they succeed in their quest to become a Marine officer, they will almost certainly go to Iraq. In the future, if you plan to attack my integrity, please have the courtesy to explain to me specifically the instances in which you think that I lied.

Next, scrawled across the doorway to my office, you wrote, “Recruiters are Traitors.” Please explain this one. How exactly am I a traitor? Was I a traitor when I joined the Marine Corps all those years ago? Is every Marine, therefore, a traitor? Was I a traitor during my two stints in Iraq? Was I a traitor when I was delivering humanitarian aid to the victims of the tsunami in Sumatra? Or do you only consider me a traitor while I am on this job? The fact is, recruitment is and always has been a part of maintaining any military organization. In fact, recruitment is a necessity of any large organization. Large corporations have employees that recruit full-time. Even you, I’m sure, must expend some effort to recruit for Code Pink. So what, exactly, is it that makes me a traitor?

The fact is this: any independent nation must maintain a military (or be allied with those who do) to ensure the safety and security of its citizens. Regardless of what your opinions are of the current administration or the current conflict in Iraq, the U.S. military will be needed again in the future. If your counter-recruitment efforts are ultimately successful, who will defend us if we are directly attacked again as we were at Pearl Harbor? Who would respond if a future terrorist attack targets the Golden Gate Bridge, the BART system, or the UC Berkeley clock tower? And, to address the most hypocritical stance that your organization takes on its website, where would the peace keeping force come from that you advocate sending to Darfur?

Finally, I believe that your efforts in protesting my office are misdirected. I agree that your stated goals of peace and social justice are worthy ones. War is a terrible thing that should only be undertaken in the most dire, extreme, and necessary of circumstances. However, war is made by politicians. The conflict in Iraq was ordered by the president and authorized by Congress. They are the ones who have the power to change the policy in Iraq, not members of the military. We execute policy to the best of our ability and to the best of our human capacity. Protesting in front of my office may be an easy way to get your organization in the headlines of local papers, but it doesn’t further any of your stated goals.

To conclude, I don’t consider myself a “recruiter.” I am a Marine who happens to be on recruiting duty. As such, I conduct myself in accordance with our core values of honor, courage, and commitment. I will never sacrifice my honor by lying to anyone that walks into my office. I will never forsake the courage that it takes to restrain myself in the face of insulting and libelous labels like liar and traitor. And, most importantly, I will never waver from my commitment to helping individuals who desire to serve their country as officers in the Marine Corps.



Captain Richard Lund is the United States Marine Corps’ officer selection officer for the northern Bay Area.

Berkeley Daily Planet

That is a good letter. But arguing with a left leaning organization like Code Pink is useless. The left fuels it's causes with emotion. Facts, like the captain stated, don't factor in to their thinking and they will never, ever listen to them. They feel, therefore they act. And facts will only get in the way so they tune them out.

[RMNIXON]

I just love it when Liberals get In Touch with their Inner Nazi!


YouTube - Marine Corps supporters and detractors arguing in Berkeley

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by RMNIXON

I just love it when Liberals get In Touch with their Inner Nazi!


YouTube - Marine Corps supporters and detractors arguing in Berkeley

Yeah, not wanting a Marine Corps. recruiting office in your town is just like gassing millions of Jews.

[Stylerod]

Originally Posted by RMNIXON

I just love it when Liberals get In Touch with their Inner Nazi!


YouTube - Marine Corps supporters and detractors arguing in Berkeley

Arguing with a liberal is like arguing with your TV set.

[bheld]

Do you guys think you can stop your circle jerk long enough to realize that Code Pink is as apt an analogy to liberalism as abortion clinic bombers are to conservatism?

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by bheld

Do you guys think you can stop your circle jerk long enough to realize that Code Pink is as apt an analogy to liberalism as abortion clinic bombers are to conservatism?

Code Pink is glorified by the media and Democratic politicians. Abortion clinic bombers are abhorred by the media and Republican politicians.