Is it impossible to tell the truth without being considered racist?

[David Octavius]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

1) Republicans will or already do hate Obama, his negatives on Rasmussen have hit near 50%...aka basically as many republicans dislike him now as ever disliked Bill Clinton

The GOP will refuse to allow Obama's agenda to get through because if it worked he'd win a second term and they'd be in danger of losing their once safe seats of districts start re-alligning

If Obama is nominated, he will be looked at with disgust as John Kerry was...people still on this board, who never knew a damn thing about John Kerry in 2003, still REALLY dislike him to this day because the GOP smeared him, the same will happen to Obama

2) The GOP couldn't stand that their little republican revolution was blocked by the Clintons holding the white house for 8 years, you can't possibly expect a rationale person to be subjected to things like the Arkansas Project, and when they defend themselves call them "divisie"

3) Sexist comment, every candidate and president I can think of has done the same thing

1) You didn't address my first point

2) She has been divisive before "the revolution"

3) Its not sexist - stop throwing that word around for everything, it loses it meaning. If Obama was throwing hissy fits I would say he has mood swings but he hasn't, she has and this is only the CAMPAIGN not the Presidency

[7960]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

This is sort of on topic as it involves racism and Obama. But has anyone seen all the stuff about how racist Obama's wife and his minister of 20 years are? Holy hell. I can't believe it doesn't get more airtime.

It will.

And they both seem to really, really dislike white people.

I don't think his wife's comments are/were racist. There are two ways to take most of what she said and I tend to lean toward the "she meant it the non-racist way" side. But the minister............wtf. Dude's a fucking nutjob and obama sat in his pew for 20 years. At some point you have to think he should have thought, well, "this guy's a nutjob" and left. But he didn't. It will come back to haunt him.

[Stylerod]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

Everyone is too busy, the "wacko-left" and "democrat haters" have allied themselves to flood the airwaves (and this board) with how racist Hillary is

I really don't think she is racist, but I also think that if she feels race baiting can help her win she will do it.

[Thorgrim]

1) You said she can't cross the aisle, obama can't either...no one can

2) You mean when the GOP was smearing her in the 92 general, ok...but do you want to explain how she was "divisive" in say the 1980s, while Obama has been "non-divisive" as a very liberal and partisan legislator in Illinois?

3) you must have missed a lot of him during the debates, like when he was all pissy that he was down double digits in every state except Iowa:

It showed a side of Barack Obama not seen before or since. And it wasn’t pretty. Asked in the Saturday Democratic debate about her dearth of “likability,” Clinton offered an answer both artful and sweet — first, demurely saying her feelings were hurt and mock-heroically adding that she would try to carry on regardless, then generously conceding that Obama is very likable and “I don’t think I’m that bad.”
At which point, Obama, yielding to some inexplicable impulse, gave the other memorable unscripted moment of the New Hampshire campaign — the gratuitous self-indicting aside: “You’re likable enough, Hillary.” He said it looking down and with not a smile but a smirk.
Rising rock star puts down struggling diva — an unkind cut, deeply ungracious, almost cruel, from a candidate who had the country in a swoon over his campaign of grace and uplift. The media gave that moment little play, but millions saw it live, and I could surely not have been the only one who found it jarring.

Then he had to throw in this later:
"You challenge the status quo and suddenly the claws come out."

There are more, but there are better examples from candidates who haven't been repeating the same speech for the past year and never ever want to discuss policy or even ideological differences

[Thorgrim]

He is already being smeared across Fox's media, by their regular hots and conservative commentators...and this isn't just limited to fox

YouTube Video

Of course, this is all going to go away in the general election, it's not going to heat up 100x over

Some of you guys are blindly walking right into a mine-field

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by 7960

But the minister............wtf. Dude's a fucking nutjob and obama sat in his pew for 20 years. At some point you have to think he should have thought, well, "this guy's a nutjob" and left. But he didn't. It will come back to haunt him.

I agree completely. It's really hurting my view of Obama at the moment. I'm pretty pissed off he hasn't responded to this in a way I feel is appropriate. And really, I don't think there's much of anything he can say to make this situation any better for him. If I walked into that church and heard the shit he was saying I would have gotten up and walked out. I would not have became his friend, had him marry me, baptize my children or continue contact with him when dealing with political issues.. especially a presidential campaign. I've been wanting to make a thread about it, but there's just so much material that I haven't had time to sit down and summarize all the info from the multitude of events/sources to make a post about it. It really deserves a lengthy post.

[Rouger2]

Originally Posted by David Octavius

I'm independent and I don't want her to be President for reasons I've stated ad-nausea that you Thor are unable to refute so you keep attacking Obama.

1) She cannot reach across the aisle - many republicans hate her for mostly dumb reasons - but hate her nonetheless. Can't get anything major done in politics without the other party.

2) Part of her divisness is her own doing - and playing the victim as the Clinton's love to do, does not make friends on the other side.

3) Her emotional outbursts - angry one day, nice the next, is not what a good leader is made off, unless you like moody people?

Her emotional outburst or crying were to let regular everyday women know that it was alright to vote for her. She was not a strident voiced, angry all the time, NOW member radiical feminist, but she is.

[7960]

Originally Posted by JaJae

If I walked into that church and heard the shit he was saying I would have gotten up and walked out. I would not have became his friend, had him marry me, baptize my children or continue contact with him when dealing with political issues.

The whole "I don't necessarily agree with everything he says" thing is bullshit, too. It's like going to Klan meetings and using the excuse "I don't agree with all of their views but I like what they've got to say about landscaping."

Come on.............if my pastor started talking about how blacks are fucking up america I'd probably listen politely for a few minutes hoping he was going to bring it around to a sane ending. But if he just kept going I'd figure it out and not come back.

[David Octavius]

Originally Posted by Thorgrim

He is already being smeared across Fox's media, by their regular hots and conservative commentators...and this isn't just limited to fox

YouTube Video

Of course, this is all going to go away in the general election, it's not going to heat up 100x over

Some of you guys are blindly walking right into a mine-field

Right and nothing is going to happen to Hillary right?

[Thorgrim]

Originally Posted by David Octavius

Right and nothing is going to happen to Hillary right?

Yeah, Hillary is going to collapse once they find out about White Water

She's been living under a microscope for 16 years and they dug up everything they could on her long ago...she has no secret past or new revelations...all they have are old stories which people already know yet still give have her tied with McCain like Obama is...

To say she is "vetted" isn't to do her justice, she's been super-ultra-vetted

They are going to smear Obama so bad, Kerry will feel like he's the most respected person in America...and just like Kerry Obama will be going "huh wha?" he fumbles around during debates, couldn't handle it when the press asked him tough questions about NAFTA, he's a horrible general election candidate in the internet era

[Rouger2]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

This is sort of on topic as it involves racism and Obama. But has anyone seen all the stuff about how racist Obama's wife and his minister of 20 years are? Holy hell. I can't believe it doesn't get more airtime. But I'm guessing people are worried they will be called racist if they show how racist those two people are.

But you gotta wonder. Those two people have major roles in his life and have for a long time. And they both seem to really, really dislike white people. Some of that cynicism and anger must have rubbed off on him.

I think many black people feel that way.and I bet that is not the only church were that kind of stuff is preached. That just shows what a hell of a problem we have here in this country with getting the people together as Obama says he wants to do. I think many of the other black leaders feel that way also, but I really do not think Obama does, and is why at first he did not have all the black support he has now, but because of what Bill Clinton had to say he does. We need to get black and white leaders together on television and with all of us watching have a real knock down, honest, hard intelligent debate on this, hell of a problem. I don't know if it would do any good since eveyone would probably just go back to their old arguements, but it would worth a try.

[Thorgrim]

arguing about race you might as well have two candidates on stage trying to solve whether we should adopt methodist or catholic views on raising your kids...ultimate waste of time

people are set in their ways, you need decades not minutes to solve those sorts of problems

[David Octavius]

Originally Posted by JaJae

I agree completely. It's really hurting my view of Obama at the moment. I'm pretty pissed off he hasn't responded to this in a way I feel is appropriate. And really, I don't think there's much of anything he can say to make this situation any better for him. If I walked into that church and heard the shit he was saying I would have gotten up and walked out. I would not have became his friend, had him marry me, baptize my children or continue contact with him when dealing with political issues.. especially a presidential campaign. I've been wanting to make a thread about it, but there's just so much material that I haven't had time to sit down and summarize all the info from the multitude of events/sources to make a post about it. It really deserves a lengthy post.

His pastor is a racist in my opinion but I am not going to blame the son for the sins of the father - old school African American generation grew up around accepted racism and being told they are second class citizens. Doesn't justify what he says at all but those memories probably makes him feel he must empower his community this way - which is different reason for saying these things than say Pat Robinson.

Obama hasn't bought into it. None of his legislation or speeches hint of hate at it at all. But Obama does need to distance himself a little more from those comments.

To me this is nothing compared to McCain actively courting the very pastors he deemed "agents of intolerance" - McCain is giving these anti-Semites and racists power and a stronger voice

[Thorgrim]

He's not telling white people he hates them, give him another cookie

[RMNIXON]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

I really don't think she is racist, but I also think that if she feels race baiting can help her win she will do it.

Yes!

[RMNIXON]

I am going to post something because you know Dick Nixon is always honest!

Well Ok, but you do know I would rather have a root canal than lend any support to certain members of the board.


I am not convinced that Obama is the better candidate to go up against McCain in the general election. I could be wrong, but I watched while people treated Howard Dean like the Second Coming.

And I am very pleased to watch both of them beat each other up as much as possible before we know who that candidate will be.

[7960]

Originally Posted by David Octavius

His pastor is a racist in my opinion but I am not going to blame the son for the sins of the father - old school African American generation grew up around accepted racism and being told they are second class citizens. Doesn't justify what he says at all but those memories probably makes him feel he must empower his community this way - which is different reason for saying these things than say Pat Robinson.

so it's ok to be racist if you're black but not if you're white?

most minorities at least *try* to hide their reverse racism

Obama hasn't bought into it. None of his legislation or speeches hint of hate at it at all. But Obama does need to distance himself a little more from those comments.

By continuing to go he's giving tacit approval of the messages his minister is sending.

To me this is nothing compared to McCain actively courting the very pastors he deemed "agents of intolerance" - McCain is giving these anti-Semites and racists power and a stronger voice

Or he's trying to change them now that he has more influence.

[David Octavius]

Originally Posted by 7960

so it's ok to be racist if you're black but not if you're white?

most minorities at least *try* to hide their reverse racism

This is the reason your an idiot...

I said he was a racist but I also tried to understand where it came from, stuff like this does not just pop out thin air, there is a cause and effect. If we can understand the causes we as a people can stop its effects. And I said it does not justify his rants, he is still totally wrong..your just an idiot dude