Should religion be illegal?

[Martel]

Religion should be abolished, put simply, because religions are the root of most wars. If you look at the evidence, it is easy to see where religion has made its contribution to a large majority of wars that have taken their place in history.

Islam starts wars because they believe without a doubt that anyone who isn't a Muslim should be executed simply for not being a Muslim. Christianity tries to seem peaceful, but if you meet a fanatical Christian, they're anger would almost certainly turn into fury and then into murderous rage at the slightest blasphemy against their so-called God.

The list of hateful religions is quite extensive, religion in itself tries to preach peace even while they kill in the name of their God, for petty and insignificant reasons. Someone once told me that they would never watch the movie, "The Da Vinci Code," because it says that Jesus was married and had a kid. And it also "supposedly" subliminally states that Jesus killed a man. Now, I have seen the movie numerous times and never once, even in the slightest, does it make any suggestion that Jesus killed anyone. That movie simply states that Jesus was a mortal man, not the Son of God. And that Jesus' divinity was created by man.

Religions create fanatics, fanatics become killers in the name of their religion, and killers start wars. Therefore it could be concluded that religions start wars.

-Martel-

[Schrödinger's Cat]

I am an atheist, but even I don't think outlawing religion would be a good thing. I don't think the state should legislate for or against religion. The state should be completely neutral.

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by Schrödinger's Cat

I am an atheist, but even I don't think outlawing religion would be a good thing. I don't think the state should legislate for or against religion. The state should be completely neutral.

Agreed.

Let people believe in whatever they want as long as it doesn't interfere with my liberties.



edit - and don't expect me to respect or even acknowledge any of your silly beliefs.

[Rouger2]

Without the Christian religion western civilization would never have developed to the level it has with us being the acme of western civilization. Religions are good for the people who belong to that religion and truely believe in it. It teaches people how to get along and not to give into our natural inclination to kill each other and let that get in the way of building a civilization and us working together to do that. Religions for the most part don't get along with other religions though and there lies most of the violence that is happening and has happened.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Martel

Religion should be abolished

Your belief that religion should be abolished should not overweight the importance of freedom and independence. As has been said already, religion should be welcome to those who wish to subscribe, but the government should be a separate entity.

[imind]

Originally Posted by martel

Islam starts wars because they believe without a doubt that anyone who isn't a Muslim should be executed simply for not being a Muslim.

rubbish. please learn more about islam before posting on it again.

Originally Posted by rouger2

Without the Christian religion western civilization would never have developed to the level it has with us being the acme of western civilization.

even more rubbish. the western world owes its debt to the age of enlightenment which happened in spite of, and certainly not becuase of, christianity.

i voted no cuase the state has no business in such matters.

[Rouger2]

Originally Posted by imind

rubbish. please learn more about islam before posting on it again.
even more rubbish. the western world owes its debt to the age of enlightenment which happened in spite of, and certainly not becuase of, christianity.

i voted no cuase the state has no business in such matters.

Where did the western world get it willing workers to do all the lousy serf work of building a society. People who did not care about the hardships of this world for they would get their reward in heaven. Christians.

[imind]

what i find most remarkable about western society is not its infrastructure.

[7960]

Originally Posted by imind

rubbish. please learn more about islam before posting on it again.

I find it interesting that I've had a muslim tell me exactly that...."in my religion it is acceptable for me to kill you where you stand because you are not muslim." Was he wrong or lying?






OP, religion should no more be illegal than knitting clubs, the PTA, Boy Scouts, Future Farmers of America, etc, etc. The suggestion that someone has the right to tell me what I can and can't believe would lead me to want to shoot that person in the face.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by 7960

I find it interesting that I've had a muslim tell me exactly that...."in my religion it is acceptable for me to kill you where you stand because you are not muslim." Was he wrong or lying?

It depends on how literal they take the Koran. There's a lot of parts modernized Muslims tend to skip over just like there's parts of the Bible people tend to skip over.

[thewise1]

Religion isn't the root of all wars, it's merely the tool used to motivate masses to fight to gain land for a few elite rulers of the people.

That's when it's twisted by those in power, too.

[JaJae]

On the flip side one could argue that atheism is the cause of things like abortion, communism, etc.. I could make a laundry list of things to blame atheism on and then say "should atheism be illegal?" As individuals in a free society we should all be free to hold whatever spiritual beliefs we wish as long as we're not hurting anybody else.

[imind]

Originally Posted by 7960

I find it interesting that I've had a muslim tell me exactly that...."in my religion it is acceptable for me to kill you where you stand because you are not muslim." Was he wrong or lying?

he was wrong, though i have no doubt you will find some who argue on his behalf, and some who might actually be able to argue it semi-intelligently. but the quran is pretty clear...

"Let there be no compulsion in religion: Truth stands out clear from Error: whoever rejects Taghut (evil) and believes in Allah hath grasped the most trust worthy hand-hold, that never breaks. And Allah heareth and knoweth all things. " (Qur'an 2:256)

i would love to know your friends response to this, and would appreciate you bringing it to his attention.

[Schrödinger's Cat]

Originally Posted by JaJae

On the flip side one could argue that atheism is the cause of things like abortion, communism, etc.. I could make a laundry list of things to blame atheism on and then say "should atheism be illegal?" As individuals in a free society we should all be free to hold whatever spiritual beliefs we wish as long as we're not hurting anybody else.

Atheism doesn't cause those things, and those things aren't done in the name of atheism. The people wanting them done may be atheists, but that is irrelevant. The disadvantage that we have as atheists is that we aren't a unified group. We are independent-minded by nature. Just to tell you, there are plenty of atheists like me that are more strongly influenced by people like Thomas Jefferson and James Madison than any Communist.

[imind]

Atheism doesn't cause those things, and those things aren't done in the name of atheism. The people wanting them done may be atheists, but that is irrelevant.

i think the arguement is that communism, abortion, etc., are the result of 'godlessness'. of course its nonsense.

[kombayn]

If you made religion illegal in America, there would be Civil War. Believe that. It's in direct violation of the First Amendment. Our country was founded by Men of God, if you watch the HBO Mini-Series Event, John Adams (it's extremely well made) you'll see that they fought under the flag of God. Religion helps a lot of people, like someone said before though, if you let Government control it, then you have problems.

[Schrödinger's Cat]

Originally Posted by kombayn

If you made religion illegal in America, there would be Civil War. Believe that. It's in direct violation of the First Amendment. Our country was founded by Men of God, if you watch the HBO Mini-Series Event, John Adams (it's extremely well made) you'll see that they fought under the flag of God. Religion helps a lot of people, like someone said before though, if you let Government control it, then you have problems.

It would never happen in America, as it would violate the rights guaranteed by the constitution. I see a greater threat that the separation between church and state would be eroded in favor of religious people, rather than against them. We have a history in our country to push religious beliefs where, in my opinion, they don't belong (e.g., public school science education). Atheists are, oddly enough, one of the least liked groups in America. What is it about us that is so bad? We simply don't believe in a deity.

Check out this Gallup Poll:

Between now and the 2008 political conventions, there will be discussion about the qualifications of presidential candidates -- their education, age, religion, race, and so on. If your party nominated a generally well-qualified person for president who happened to be [ITEM A-J READ IN ORDER], would you vote for that person?

Atheists score worst than Homosexuals.
The Presidency

[jimeigh]

it shouldnt be illegal. reasons concerning freedom aside (these ARE the more important reasons.... however...), if you outlaw their religion, they'll become exactly the kind of fanatics you were trying to be rid of.

[Rino]

Originally Posted by 7960

I find it interesting that I've had a muslim tell me exactly that...."in my religion it is acceptable for me to kill you where you stand because you are not muslim." Was he wrong or lying?

It depends on which version of the Qur'an he follows.

Much like the bible, the Qur'an has been changed, and or interpreted over and over again since it was first written.

To keep this simple, I will use one example.

In version one, it speaks of Jihad, and through translation it says Jihad is the fight between good and evil that exists in each person. It is a Jihad that they must win within themselves. Kind of like bad devil on one shoulder telling you to take that money, no one will know, and the angel on the other shoulder telling you to stop.

In version two when it speaks of Jihad, it is talking about the fight between good and evil exterior of that person, and he must overcome evil. They then interpreted it to mean that anyone who was not of their faith is evil. And you know where that leads.

Same thing with the bible, it has been interpreted over and over again until the interpretation was so bastardized that much of the meaning was lost. Like (I can not remember the exact verse, and I will check for accuracy) it says that when someone speaks of false gods, and comes to take you from Him, you must stone him to death. This verse did not even exist before Babylon, it was added by those who wanted to shove their religion down everyone else's throats.

It is not religion that is evil, it is not religion that has people do horrid things to each other. It is the people that interpret it that way.

So, instead of outlawing religion, I think we should outlaw stupid people. It would be easier.

[7960]

Originally Posted by imind

he was wrong, though i have no doubt you will find some who argue on his behalf, and some who might actually be able to argue it semi-intelligently. but the quran is pretty clear...

i would love to know your friends response to this, and would appreciate you bringing it to his attention.

He wasn't my friend. I was teaching to a company from the middle east and they came to boston because I refused to go there. I always found it interesting to talk to people about something specific about their life. A few general questions to anyone and what they hold dear comes clear pretty quick. This guy was all about his religion.....he wouldn't shake a female instructor's hand and he wouldn't acknowledge my jewish boss was even in the room. I asked him a question about something he said and during his answer he mentioned what I quoted above.

I basically stopped talking to him at that point and only addressed work-related questions for the rest of the two weeks. Although I did stop acknowledging my jewish boss, and at review time told him it would be acceptable for me to kill him if he didn't give me a good review. He said "that took a lot of balls to say" and then laughed until he hurt himself.