Lew would be proud-Lake of fire (abortion documentary)

It'sJustMe · 04-23-2008, 10:55 PM

I never thought a movie could change my views on abortion, but this one was a total eye opener.

I sat here last summer while I was pregnant and said (and believed) that while I was carrying a life within, that life was not worthy of the right to live unless I chose that. I'm shocked that I went 10 years with that belief. Ironically enough, I was staunchly pro-life until I had my very first baby, 11 years ago. She was maybe a year old when I became pro-choice. My second baby is now 8 months old, and I feel myself incredibly torn.

Watching an actual (albeit 2nd trimester) abortion being performed struck me to my core.

Has anyone else seen this movie?

Kytro · 04-24-2008, 12:58 AM

I have not, but movies never really shock me, and certainly won't change my mind based on footage, though it may if it presents new information I was not aware of.

I have never believed life is important simply because it is life, it is what that life represents that is valuable.

It'sJustMe · 04-24-2008, 08:41 AM

It wasn't so much the movie but what the movie represented and how I chose to interpret everything. It really made me think about life, the meaning of life and the value of life.

I look at my 8 month old child and cannot believe that there was a day that I considered having an abortion with him. I simply can't imagine him not here, or that I had the right to end his life.

I was never the pro-choice person to believe that an embryo/fetus was simply a 'blob of cells'. I have always fully recognized the fact that the unborn is a human being, simply that it was not sentient and worthy of life until the mother chose life.

I'm not saying that I have become pro-life, but I am certainly reevaluating my beliefs on abortion.

7960 · 04-24-2008, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by It'sJustMe

I look at my 8 month old child and cannot believe that there was a day that I considered having an abortion with him. I simply can't imagine him not here, or that I had the right to end his life.

Abortion would never have been an option, no matter what, so we didn't even get any of the prenatal tests. That doesn't mean nobody else should have the option.

I'm not shocked at all that a director could make a movie that would "shock" some people. In fact he'd be a shitty movie maker if he couldn't.

motivez · 04-24-2008, 10:43 AM

In showing that the goal is to shock you with the graphic nature of the procedure itself, much like other films that show beheadings or whatever.. it's designed to elicit an emotional response one way or another.

I'm not saying it's an entirely to act based on emotion, but I think very graphic films have the ability to make people put their rationality aside entirely.

It'sJustMe · 04-24-2008, 04:35 PM

Originally Posted by motivez

In showing that the goal is to shock you with the graphic nature of the procedure itself, much like other films that show beheadings or whatever.. it's designed to elicit an emotional response one way or another.

I'm not saying it's an entirely to act based on emotion, but I think very graphic films have the ability to make people put their rationality aside entirely.

I honestly doubt a beheading would affect me the same way. I am pro-death penalty.

7960, I had all the prenatal tests done short of an amnio. I thought it would be best to be prepared after birth if something was wrong.

I am not familiar with the director. My dh rented me the movie because he knew I was interested in the subject.

jimeigh · 05-02-2008, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by It'sJustMe

It wasn't so much the movie but what the movie represented and how I chose to interpret everything. It really made me think about life, the meaning of life and the value of life.

I look at my 8 month old child and cannot believe that there was a day that I considered having an abortion with him. I simply can't imagine him not here, or that I had the right to end his life.

...

I am pro-death penalty.

WickedLou9 · 05-02-2008, 02:31 PM

Appealing to emotion rather than reason. I think you have to recognize when someone is trying to sideskirt reason and appeal to you emotionally. There is a reason for doing so, and it usually means that thier arguements can not stand on thier own merit. Having a child myself I am not immune to the emotional appeal either, but I try my best to reason through the issue.

My own personal belief is that abortion is a terrible thing. I also recognize that in some cases it might be the best option, or potentially might even be medically necesary to save the mothers life. In some rare instances it could be justified. For that reason I like to quote Bill Clinton. Abortion should be safe, legal and rare.

Kytro · 05-03-2008, 11:13 PM

I really have little problem with the concept, I doubt I would approve when if affects me, but that is a personal decision.

I believe abortion to be amoral.

Galactic Gigolo · 05-04-2008, 10:10 PM

As a woman you lack the ability to think rationally.

Next.

lew · 05-05-2008, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

Appealing to emotion rather than reason. I think you have to recognize when someone is trying to sideskirt reason and appeal to you emotionally. There is a reason for doing so, and it usually means that thier arguements can not stand on thier own merit. Having a child myself I am not immune to the emotional appeal either, but I try my best to reason through the issue.

My own personal belief is that abortion is a terrible thing. I also recognize that in some cases it might be the best option, or potentially might even be medically necesary to save the mothers life. In some rare instances it could be justified. For that reason I like to quote Bill Clinton. Abortion should be safe, legal and rare.

I feel that neither side appeals to reason in this case.

Usually, pro-choicers are all about the emotion of "women's rights", "privacy", etc without reasonably arguing that abortion should be legal and moral.

lew · 05-05-2008, 02:29 PM

I'm staunchly pro-life until I read the arguments of Murray Rothbard or even dumpy.

kombayn · 05-05-2008, 05:36 PM

I'm Pro-1st Term Abortion, Anti-2nd Term Abortion. When in the 2nd term, the fetus is growing body parts you can't kill that person. In the 1st term, does the fetus even have brain activity? I highly doubt it, so to me it doesn't exist into being yet. So I'm Pro-Choice but with limitations to the rights and liberty of the fetus becoming a human being.

Rhianann · 06-14-2008, 01:50 AM

Originally Posted by kombayn

I'm Pro-1st Term Abortion, Anti-2nd Term Abortion. When in the 2nd term, the fetus is growing body parts you can't kill that person. In the 1st term, does the fetus even have brain activity? I highly doubt it, so to me it doesn't exist into being yet. So I'm Pro-Choice but with limitations to the rights and liberty of the fetus becoming a human being.

I'm with you on that one. An abortion after first term is downright sick. The planet is overpopulated. Abortion is necessary.

Kytro · 06-17-2008, 09:08 PM

Originally Posted by Rhianann

I'm with you on that one. An abortion after first term is downright sick. The planet is overpopulated. Abortion is necessary.

It never ceases to amaze me how easily people are swayed by appearance

Rouger2 · 06-17-2008, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by It'sJustMe

It wasn't so much the movie but what the movie represented and how I chose to interpret everything. It really made me think about life, the meaning of life and the value of life.

I look at my 8 month old child and cannot believe that there was a day that I considered having an abortion with him. I simply can't imagine him not here, or that I had the right to end his life.

I was never the pro-choice person to believe that an embryo/fetus was simply a 'blob of cells'. I have always fully recognized the fact that the unborn is a human being, simply that it was not sentient and worthy of life until the mother chose life.

I'm not saying that I have become pro-life, but I am certainly reevaluating my beliefs on abortion.

I think if we are to survive as a society we must treasure life. We must never believe it is something to just throw away. We must always hold tight to it and hold on to it as long as it is life. When we don't then we are doomed as a society. The only reason we are here is to carry on the human race everything else we do just supports that, so the job of parent is the most important job that we will ever do.

Libertaire · 07-05-2008, 07:24 AM

The value of human life and the love of others is not altogether rational, nor is it altogether emotional. It's just one of those things that I think most of us instinctually and voluntarily realize.
I used to think I could be both "pro-choice" and "pro-life" until I knew my wife (then girlfriend) was pregnant. The first time I heard the heartbeat or when I first saw the ultra-sound, I responded both emotionally and rationally. This was a human life at its earliest stages. Remarkable. Moreso, this human life was an extension of both of our lives. We both knew that we were a family.

Dumpy Dooby · 07-05-2008, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by lew

I'm staunchly pro-life until I read the arguments of Murray Rothbard or even dumpy.

Whoa.