Why the death penalty is stupid

[Stylerod]

Originally Posted by Donkey®

"Monumentally?" Really? How many girls are you assuming are raped and killed? Just in the article they are saying 31 people in Texas alone have been cleared of crimes they didn't commit. We can use any number you want for the rest of the US, how about 5 per state? 49 x 5 = 245...and I think 5 per state is a conservative number. The only thing I can't say is what timeframe this is within...my conservative guess would be when DNA testing became more prevalent and reliable in the US...I'd say that was around the mid to late 80's? How many raped and murdered little girls have their been? You think 1000? That is NOT way off from the number of wrongly convicted men freed by DNA testing. While it may not be the greatest comparison, it isn't as far-fetched as you're trying to make it seem...besides, my point got across just fine.

31 death row inmates have been released because of DNA testing in just Texas??

[7960]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

31 death row inmates have been released because of DNA testing in just Texas??

:edit:

To clarify the numbers of people freed by DNA in Dallas County and Texas: 31 people in Texas have been fully exonerated through DNA testing in Texas

StandDown Texas Project: Another DNA Exoneration in Dallas County




And then we get to the issue of deny a re-test that would prove innocence or guilt.

DNA retesting denied for Texas death row inmate

There's this catch-22 that "You need the evidence to show you're innocent, but you can't get into court without the evidence." His evidence to prove he's innocent is a DNA test, but they won't do it because he doesn't have evidence that he's innocent. WTF.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

Some crimes are bad enough that death is deserved. Some guy rapes and murders a few little girls. Gets convicted and spends the rest of his life eating free meals, getting free education, working out and watching Deal or no Deal. Yeah, great justice.

Death isn't a punishment. It's revenge for the people wronged.

Anyway, I'd rather have 100 bad guys locked in a cement box for the rest of thier lives , even if they get to watch TV, and at the same time prevent an innocenent person from being put to death.

I also think that your picture of prison is fucking retarded nonsense and I am pretty sure you know better.... Pardon my french.

[Linzyhop]

depends on the prison really. could be a walk in the park, could be hard time. depends where they are.

and i guess i'm in the minority, but i believe in the eye for an eye when it comes to rape or murdering someone in cold blood. that person doesn't deserve to live, and on top of that, their execution brings some closure to the family of those victims.

I know plenty of people feel differently here, but that's how I feel.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

depends on the prison really. could be a walk in the park, could be hard time. depends where they are.

and i guess i'm in the minority, but i believe in the eye for an eye when it comes to rape or murdering someone in cold blood. that person doesn't deserve to live, and on top of that, their execution brings some closure to the family of those victims.

I know plenty of people feel differently here, but that's how I feel.

so you'd be ok with 27 years later having the courts say "oh shit, we executed the wrong guy!"

?

[Linzyhop]

Originally Posted by 7960

so you'd be ok with 27 years later having the courts say "oh shit, we executed the wrong guy!"

?

i am ok with having someone killed if they raped or murdered someone. I'm not talking about innocence, I'm talking about guilty.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

i am ok with having someone killed if they raped or murdered someone. I'm not talking about innocence, I'm talking about guilty.

and you can be 100% sure of guilt?

[Linzyhop]

as i said, i'm not bringing into account of possible innocents being guilty..

i'm saying if someone raped and/or murdered, i'm ok with that person being executed.

I'd like to know how many others on this board feel that way, not bringing into account of innocents being called guilty. i'm talking about the actual guilty.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

as i said, i'm not bringing into account of possible innocents being guilty..

i'm saying if someone raped and/or murdered, i'm ok with that person being executed.

I'd like to know how many others on this board feel that way, not bringing into account of innocents being called guilty. i'm talking about the actual guilty.

There is no way you can ever be sure enough about someones guilt that you can put them to death. In a magical world where we can go back in time and watch someone to see if they really did it, then maybe you can be sure about guilt. Short of that.. I don't see how.

[Linzyhop]

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

There is no way you can ever be sure enough about someones guilt that you can put them to death. In a magical world where we can go back in time and watch someone to see if they really did it, then maybe you can be sure about guilt. Short of that.. I don't see how.

that wasn't my question.

i asked how many people on here would say it was okay to have someone executed if that person had actually raped or murdered someone.

I'm not talking innocent/guilty verdict. i'm saying that person actually perpetrated that crime. who thinks it's okay if they were executed.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

as i said, i'm not bringing into account of possible innocents being guilty..

i'm saying if someone raped and/or murdered, i'm ok with that person being executed.

But you can't separate the two. I've said nearly the same thing so on that part we agree....... *IF* there was a way to *KNOW* someone is guilty then put 'em down. But the question you're avoiding is, is it possible to *KNOW*?

I'd like to know how many others on this board feel that way, not bringing into account of innocents being called guilty. i'm talking about the actual guilty.

"i'm talking about the actual guilty" ........ as determined by???????????

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

that wasn't my question.

i asked how many people on here would say it was okay to have someone executed if that person had actually raped or murdered someone.

I'm not talking innocent/guilty verdict. i'm saying that person actually perpetrated that crime. who thinks it's okay if they were executed.

does this answer your question?



Him: Some crimes are bad enough that death is deserved. ...........

Me: I totally agree.

And when we create a system that guarantees an innocent person will never be convicted and put to death then I'll be the first to sign the petition to re-instate the death penalty.

But until then humans are too infallible to judge and put other humans to death.

[Linzyhop]

Originally Posted by 7960

"i'm talking about the actual guilty" ........ as determined by???????????

.....committing the crime.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

.....committing the crime.

And you know this by....................?

[Linzyhop]

Originally Posted by 7960

And you know this by....................?

stop trolling dude. you know exactly what i'm saying.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

stop trolling dude. you know exactly what i'm saying.

Ok if you stop living in a theoretical world for one second and answer the question about the world in which we actualky do live. In this imperfect system in which we can't possibly determine guilt to a 100% certainty, would you advocate the death penalty? There is no point talking about something if it's impossible.

I might as well ask the question: " if Leprechauns were real, would you follow one to it's pot of gold?"
Since it's a purely made up situation, the qestion and answer are of no consequence.

[Linzyhop]

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

Ok if you stop living in a theoretical world for one second and answer the question about the world in which we actualky do live. In this imperfect system in which we can't possibly determine guilt to a 100% certainty, would you advocate the death penalty? There is no point talking about something if it's impossible.

I might as well ask the question: " if Leprechauns were real, would you follow one to it's pot of gold?"
Since it's a purely made up situation, the qestion and answer are of no consequence.

every situation is different, but i think some of these criminals who are guilty of these horrific crimes should be put to death.

but alas, it doesn't matter what I believe in since I will be a mass resident for the rest of my life and as far as I know, mass doesn't have the death penalty.

but sure as shit, if i had a kid and she/he were raped/murdered, that person would deserve to die.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

stop trolling dude. you know exactly what i'm saying.

I'm not trolling. You didn't answer me.

does this answer your question?



Him: Some crimes are bad enough that death is deserved. ...........

Me: I totally agree.

And when we create a system that guarantees an innocent person will never be convicted and put to death then I'll be the first to sign the petition to re-instate the death penalty.

But until then humans are too infallible to judge and put other humans to death.

So I said I'm for the death penalty as soon as humans become infallible. YOU'RE the one avoiding the question.....how are you going to know he "did it"? What's your infallible test?

[7960]

Originally Posted by Linzyhop

every situation is different, but i think some of these criminals who are guilty of these horrific crimes should be put to death.

You still haven't answered my question. You keep saying "If he did it...." but you're not telling me how you *KNOW* he did it. Is there a reason you're avoiding the obvious answer, "because the jury found him guilty"?

but sure as shit, if i had a kid and she/he were raped/murdered, that person would deserve to die.

That's why we don't let the parents choose the punishment.

[kombayn]

An eye-for-an-eye if the person has admitted to the crime or the DNA evidence points out that the person did do the crime, yes they do deserve to die. But at the same time, if you kill an innocent person in the process, how did you help the system? Federal prison is a stiff punishment, a lot of crazy things happen inside those prisons. People argue that Death Row is a form mental cruelty that can cause one of those nut-jobs to become mentally unstable and/or ill. It's a tough situation. You have to leave those men in prison for life, and you need to get rid of people out of these holding cells that are doing victimless crimes, so the men who are doing victim/violent crimes can be put there.