Kindergarten teacher allows students to vote unpopular kid out of class.

[Ardentfrost]

Trends in Diagnosis Rates for Autism and ADHD at Hospital Discharge in the Context of Other Psychiatric Diagnoses -- Mandell et al. 56 (1): 56 -- Psychiatr Serv

You can use Google too.

CONCLUSIONS: Increases in rates of diagnosis of etiologically unrelated mental disorders suggest that there have been changes in diagnostic practices over time, increases in community prevalence of these disorders, and increased likelihood of hospitalizations for different mental disorders.

Something wrong with your kid? Let's just call it autism or ADHD or whatever else fits.

Once parents have an answer like this, they rarely get second opinions. It gives them a nice answer they can accept to ignore the problems of their child. It sucks most for those with REAL problems.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Please... "high functioning" is another term for "there's nothing wrong with the kid, we're just making up some bullshit so that parents have something to blame their kid's problems on."

I'd bet money on a lot of kids diagnosed with "high functioning" disorders are just fine.

you really have no fucking clue what you're talking about.........next are you going to tell me

-if you had him for a week you could straighten him out.
or
-all he needs is a few good smacks to make him knock it off.

?

[7960]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Trends in Diagnosis Rates for Autism and ADHD at Hospital Discharge in the Context of Other Psychiatric Diagnoses -- Mandell et al. 56 (1): 56 -- Psychiatr Serv

You can use Google too.



Something wrong with your kid? Let's just call it autism or ADHD or whatever else fits.

Once parents have an answer like this, they rarely get second opinions. It gives them a nice answer they can accept to ignore the problems of their child. It sucks most for those with REAL problems.

I love it when studies show "a 576% increase in the number of diagnosis!! but ignore the actual numbers. Here are the diagnosis numbers per 100,000



Going from 3 autistic kids/100k in '89-91 to 11/100k in '98-00 is just as easily explained by doctors, educators, and parents no longer thinking "that kid is a pain in the ass" and actually figuring out what's wrong with him.

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by 7960

Going from 3 autistic kids/100k in '89-91 to 11/100k in '98-00 is just as easily explained by doctors, educators, and parents no longer thinking "that kid is a pain in the ass" and actually figuring out what's wrong with him.

If that's what you want to believe, then that's your deal. It is a statistically significant increase in diagnosis rate. There are doctors getting charged with being to free with prescriptions (big one in the news today from Atlanta), and yet the patients regard those doctors as saints. And yet you think that the increase in diagnosis of behavioral disorders is just "well, doctors are better at diagnosing now-a-days."

I respectfully and vehemently disagree. A shift this major can only be explained by false diagnoses.

EDIT: I will say that SOME of the increase can be attributed to what you're suggesting. But not an increase by this much. It's too significant. The other choice is that we're being poisoned in a massive scale by a conspiring group. Since this explanation is half retarded and the "false diagnosis" explanation is simpler (solutions are usually the simplest of the possibilities), I don't think it's realistic.

[7960]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

I respectfully and vehemently disagree. A shift this major can only be explained by false diagnoses.

Then maybe you should find a study that agrees with what you're saying. Their conclusion:

(1) Although it is possible that the community prevalence of various psychiatric and developmental disorders is increasing, (2) it is important to consider variables such as changes in relevant policies, (3) increased awareness, and (4) changes in practice patterns that may also be causally related to these increases.

In other words, "(1) maybe there are more cases, or (2) it could be classifications have changed, or (3) they're looking for it more, or (4) (I really don't know what this one means)."

So of the 4 reasons they give, at least TWO of them are "there are more cases / they're looking for it more."


And btw, a doctor diagnosing autism doesn't get more money for diagnosing it so where's the doctor's benefit to doing it?

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by 7960

Then maybe you should find a study that agrees with what you're saying. Their conclusion:

(1) Although it is possible that the community prevalence of various psychiatric and developmental disorders is increasing, (2) it is important to consider variables such as changes in relevant policies, (3) increased awareness, and (4) changes in practice patterns that may also be causally related to these increases.

In other words, "(1) maybe there are more cases, or (2) it could be classifications have changed, or (3) they're looking for it more, or (4) (I really don't know what this one means)."

So of the 4 reasons they give, at least TWO of them are "there are more cases / they're looking for it more."

(1) agrees with you. (2) could go either way (did classifications really change, and if they did, was it needed?). (3) favors me a bit more than you ("I saw on the news that kids with X act like Y just like my kid!" and then the diagnosis fits their preconceived notions). (4) agree with me... doctors increase how free they are with the diagnosis.

And btw, a doctor diagnosing autism doesn't get more money for diagnosing it so where's the doctor's benefit to doing it?

Continued treatment/drugs/etc... most certainly DOES increase monetary gain for doctors and all kinds of people in the healthcare industry.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by 7960

Then maybe you should find a study that agrees with what you're saying. Their conclusion:

(1) Although it is possible that the community prevalence of various psychiatric and developmental disorders is increasing, (2) it is important to consider variables such as changes in relevant policies, (3) increased awareness, and (4) changes in practice patterns that may also be causally related to these increases.

In other words, "(1) maybe there are more cases, or (2) it could be classifications have changed, or (3) they're looking for it more, or (4) (I really don't know what this one means)."

So of the 4 reasons they give, at least TWO of them are "there are more cases / they're looking for it more."


And btw, a doctor diagnosing autism doesn't get more money for diagnosing it so where's the doctor's benefit to doing it?

half the time it's a teacher that catches it anyway and brings it to the attention of the family. And I am sure you agree when I say that I would rather my child be a little brat that can't behave than to be diagnosed with Autism. It's not like it's some cop out.

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

half the time it's a teacher that catches it anyway and brings it to the attention of the family. And I am sure you agree when I say that I would rather my child be a little brat that can't behave than to be diagnosed with Autism. It's not like it's some cop out.

It's easier on the teacher if the kid is diagnosed with ADHD (for instance) because the resulting drugs makes the kid easier to deal with.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

(1) agrees with you. (2) could go either way (did classifications really change, and if they did, was it needed?). (3) favors me a bit more than you ("I saw on the news that kids with X act like Y just like my kid!" and then the diagnosis fits their preconceived notions). (4) agree with me... doctors increase how free they are with the diagnosis.



Continued treatment/drugs/etc... most certainly DOES increase monetary gain for doctors and all kinds of people in the healthcare industry.

A mild case of Autism won't require medical care, it requires the parents and teachers to modify everything about how the interact with the child. If it's a case that requires medical attention and medicine, then it's a severe enough case that there is no question that the kid has Austism.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

It's easier on the teacher if the kid is diagnosed with ADHD (for instance) because the resulting drugs makes the kid easier to deal with.

ADHD is not Autism. It's not even similar.

[avsp]

People with Aspergers have often gone undiagonised in the past & its a sliding scale anyway. So those typically males things like making lists of you favourite books, films albums or obessional activities like trainspotting or birdwatching can, to some degree, be Asperger-like

If you know or are a slightly socially akward person who is often seen as 'a geek' or similar then you/they are probably further down the road than most.

I think that schools can seek extra funding & that this may be driving some diagnoses.

Its the sliding scale of the condition that makes it of dubious practical value IMO.

Of course the urge to label & characterise people by searching out some 'odd' behaviour might be seen as Asperger like

Just for fun etc
Pie Palace » Asperger Test (AQ Test)
I've often wondered, ...,

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

ADHD is not Autism. It's not even similar.

It was compared in the study I posted earlier, it's why I brought it up.

In the OP, the teacher wasn't trying to get the kid diagnosed, she was (I assume) trying to show the kid that he acts like a dick, and if he's not nice to people, they won't be nice to him. I'm not defending her really, the method was certainly... aggressive. But the parents are out there looking for a reason their kid acts like a dick.

If everyone who acts like a dick has ass-burgers, then there's a pandemic.

[WickedLou9]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

It was compared in the study I posted earlier, it's why I brought it up.

In the OP, the teacher wasn't trying to get the kid diagnosed, she was (I assume) trying to show the kid that he acts like a dick, and if he's not nice to people, they won't be nice to him. I'm not defending her really, the method was certainly... aggressive. But the parents are out there looking for a reason their kid acts like a dick.

If everyone who acts like a dick has ass-burgers, then there's a pandemic.

The problem is that the child who has Autism or Aspergers has no idea, no concept, that people can feel things. The child is completely introspective and inwardly focused. Trying to teach them in this way is pointless and probably counter productive as it would most likely drive the child even further inward. It would teach them that social interaction is painful and embaressing and would do actual damage to the child's development.

[jimeigh]

democracy at work!

[7960]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Continued treatment/drugs/etc... most certainly DOES increase monetary gain for doctors and all kinds of people in the healthcare industry.

doctors aren't diagnosing kids as autistic so *others* can get rich, unless you're suggesting there's some kind of conspiracy between the doctors and therapists who end up treating most kids. very few autistic kids are under an actual doctor's care.

[7960]

Originally Posted by WickedLou9

half the time it's a teacher that catches it anyway and brings it to the attention of the family. And I am sure you agree when I say that I would rather my child be a little brat that can't behave than to be diagnosed with Autism. It's not like it's some cop out.

yep.

nobody *wants* their kid to be autistic. the only time I saw people seeking a diagnosis was so they could get an education plan, special services, or something that required a clinical diagnosis for their insurance to cover.

[jimeigh]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Please... "high functioning" is another term for "there's nothing wrong with the kid, we're just making up some bullshit so that parents have something to blame their kid's problems on."

I'd bet money on a lot of kids diagnosed with "high functioning" disorders are just fine.

you're wrong

[jimeigh]

my girlfriends younger sister is a "high functioning autistic" kid. she's in highschool but talking to her is like talking to a 10 year old. she'll probably be able to hold a job at some point but there's no way she'll be raking in the big bucks.

now, her cousins are autistic and theirs isnt a high functioning case. they're just downright retarded-like. i heard it said that the doctor explained that these kid's who are i think 5-7 years old have the intelligence of the average 2 year old.