Republican Party Collapse: Libertarian Rising?

[Smull]

Many people have been discussing the decline of the GOP, and the potential for disaster in November if things don't change.

My Plea to Republicans: It's Time for Real Change to Avoid Real Disaster > Newt.org > Newt News and Opinion DB

No Republicans should kid themselves. It's time to face up to a stark choice.
Without change we could face a catastrophic election this fall.
Without change the Republican Party in the House could revert to the permanent minority status it had from 1930 to 1994.
Without change, the majorities of Americans who support the Republican principle of smaller, more efficient, smarter and fairer government will be in for a rude awakening.
It's time for real change to avoid a real disaster.

- Newt Gingrich

The next project: The Next Right | SorenDayton.com

My sense is that our politics, the conservative movement, and the Republican Party is at a transitional point.

http://www.qando.net/ - The Next Right

The Republican Party isn't serving the Right, and the Right isn't likely to continue serving the Republican Party.

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But if the Republicans do dramatically fall from grace, where will it go? What will replace a Bush controlled GOP? Could a more libertarian minded party emerge from its ashes?

Will Mari: Huckabee On The Next Republican Revolution - Off The Bus on The Huffington Post
Mike Huckabee:

Republicans need to be Republicans. The greatest threat to classic Republicanism is not liberalism; it's this new brand of libertarianism, which is social liberalism and economic conservatism, but it's a heartless, callous, soulless type of economic conservatism because it says "look, we want to cut taxes and eliminate government. If it means that elderly people don't get their Medicare drugs, so be it. If it means little kids go without education and healthcare, so be it." Well, that might be a quote pure economic conservative message, but it's not an American message. It doesn't fly. People aren't going to buy that, because that's not the way we are as a people. That's not historic Republicanism. Historic Republicanism does not hate government; it's just there to be as little of it as there can be. But they also recognize that government has to be paid for.

Will Mari: Huckabee On The Next Republican Revolution - Off The Bus on The Huffington Post

There have been musings about the future of the Republican Party and the possibility of it gaining a new strand of libertarianism for awhile now. But Mike Huckabee identifying it as the greatest threat to "classical" republicanism seems to make this idea more tangible. When I read this had a feeling of, "great, now we've got 'em scared".


The decline of the traditional American Right leaves an opening and an opportunity, which an Obama victory in the fall will widen. The Republican Party will be punished, devastated, and in shambles after the Democratic backlash from the eight years of Bush's Neoconservatism. Politicians on the right will be more and more inclined to position themselves as moderates, "socially liberal and economically conservative". While this type of politician is far from an ideologically pure libertarian, the half-democrat half-republican would be a huge step in the right direction. If a candidate could be found having views of , as Huckabee put it, "social liberalism and economic conservatism" it could have an enormous impact on the shape of the Republican Party. Should the America develop a more libertarian strain in the upcoming generation I believe that this is where it will begin. If it happens I believe the Republican Party will more closley resemble the right of many European nations, such as the Tories in Britain, and Sarkozy in France.

I see this scenerio as far more likely than
1. A return to Bush styled Republicanism- The party needs to change and I doubt the voters will let them back into power until they do
2. A Huckabee styled Republican Party - This would basically be the anthema to any libertarian, a government that spends more, and wants to impose religous doctrine on your lives.
3. A Libertarian 3rd Party rise- The Libertarian Party seems to me, to be just too radical to be pateable to the American public. They want to change too much too fast, which generally doesn't fly well except during times of extreme crisis and hardship, and should this occur most people won't want to hear "The government doesn't have the answer"
4. A Libertarian left - while there have been some encouraging signs of the left moving closer to a libertarian position, I can't see them wanting to, or needing to reorganize thier principals drastically enough to garner much libertarian support. Only if they face some kind of huge meltdown and lose everything would they need to take a long hard look at thier ideology and reorganize it (The Republicans may have to do this after November however)

What do you guys think?

Will November be a huge blow to the GOP?
Where will the Republican Party go if they lose big time in November?
Does a more libertarian Republican Party have a chance?

[thewise1]

It does seem like social liberals/fiscal conservatives are becoming more common - seems like everyone I talk to identifies themselves that way - but far fewer identify themselves as libertarians (I think they may not know what it means, per se, in many cases).

That said, I don't know that we're poised to destroy the GOP right now. In fact I'm sure we have a long long way to go before we do that. But I think it could happen eventually.

[Dispatcher]

I still can't figure out why Republicans say they want "small government" when it is the the Republicans in office that spend so much on the military.
They don't mind big government and spending tax dollars, as long as it isn't THEIR tax dollars and the money is spent on Defence.
But that is about to change. Even Republicans are getting tired of war after war after war. Not because of all the people killed and all the suffering it causes, but because it is expensive and ineffective.

[TankRizzo]

I'm still dumbfounded by what happened to the republican party the past 8 years.

Bush basically lied his way into office, and then when he did his 180 it seems like everyone in congress went right along with him.

[thewise1]

Originally Posted by TankRizzo

I'm still dumbfounded by what happened to the republican party the past 8 years.

Bush basically lied his way into office, and then when he did his 180 it seems like everyone in congress went right along with him.

You should see the local republican party. The things they say in their meetings caused me to stop going to said meetings; Basically if you're an independent voter that votes based on individuals, you're not welcome at all.

I think anyone who doesn't understand my disdain for the Republican party should visit some of these meetings and perhaps it would become more clear. If it doesn't then they are probably too stupid for me to care what they think anyway

[porkypine8974]

I think its safe to say the Republicans are going to get a reboot. The libertarians should 'infiltrate' the party in several places. It shouldn't be announced, just slowly move in. I think in 20-30 years, we'll have half the party. Then we would need a candidate to win the nomination for President, that would bring much more national attention to the new classical ideals. That's how I see it turning out. It won't be swift, but it will be sweat.

[Photon1001]

Paleoconservatism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Blue Dog Coalition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Libertarian philosophy isn't really as common as it might seem. Libertarians are, to give them their so well earned credit, very vocal. But a lot people who identify themselves as conservatives and have lost faith in the GOP are actually quite upset with polarizing viewpoints, and libertarianism, or more aptly, the whole free-market above all else philosophy, is not what they're looking for, ime.

[HughRuss]

Okay, since the Republican party seems to be in turmoil, maybe --as pointed out-- the Libertarian party can rise from the smoking wreckage of that plane.

But, can anybody tell me (I posed this question in a different thread, but it was never answered) on what doctrines, policies, or facets of government do republicans differ from libertarians?

[Angus_Aboot]

Originally Posted by HughRuss

Okay, since the Republican party seems to be in turmoil, maybe --as pointed out-- the Libertarian party can rise from the smoking wreckage of that plane.

It won't (at least with libertarians on board).

Originally Posted by HughRuss

But, can anybody tell me (I posed this question in a different thread, but it was never answered) on what doctrines, policies, or facets of government do republicans differ from libertarians?

Could you first explain what a republican is?

[Photon1001]

Could you first explain what a republican is?

endless piles of partisan sarcasm may now henceforth commence.

[lew]

If libertarians took over the party, which they won't, it'd be the Beltway libertarians anyway. It'd be the pro-war, lower-tax, social libertine libertarians. And they can have it for all I care.


Paleoconservatives and paleolibertarians have no party right now.


If anything, it will be a Huckabee Republican Party. Which will be retarded.

[Photon1001]

If anything, it will be a Huckabee Republican Party. Which will be retarded.

Oh, but it will be so handsome and folksy, won't it?

[DosEquis]

Originally Posted by Photon1001

Oh, but it will be so handsome and folksy, won't it?

folksy and retarded are pretty close

[Schrödinger's Cat]

He can regale us with his days as a preacher and the lend us his fried squirrel recipe.

[Photon1001]

mmmmmmm, squirrel......

[Rouger2]

First Newt is wrong or lying about conservatives being the minority party in the house from 1930 to 1994. All southern democrats or most were more conservative than any republicans during that period. So it made the conservatives the dominant party during that period. The only time I felt the liberals really ever had power was during Johnson's term in office. The conservative party will always be controlled by big business or the Military Industrial complex. You will never control that Monster it will always control you. In the competitive economic game government must act as the rule maker and referee. It is part of the competitive game that business must only think of them selves to win their game so government must be the protector of the people. Conservatives will never understand that.

[HughRuss]

Originally Posted by lew

If libertarians took over the party, which they won't, it'd be the Beltway libertarians anyway. It'd be the pro-war, lower-tax, social libertine libertarians. And they can have it for all I care.

So beltway libertarians = conservatives with different name?

[lew]

Originally Posted by HughRuss

So beltway libertarians = conservatives with different name?

Conservatives are not social libertines.

[Photon1001]

^ I agree.
Libertarian socialism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

libertarian socialists place their hopes in trade unions, workers' councils, municipalities, citizens' assemblies, and other non-bureaucratic, decentralized means of action. Most libertarian socialists advocate doing away with the state altogether, seeing it as a bulwark of capitalist class rule.

I'm not so sure that would work.

[Smull]

Originally Posted by HughRuss

Okay, since the Republican party seems to be in turmoil, maybe --as pointed out-- the Libertarian party can rise from the smoking wreckage of that plane.

But, can anybody tell me (I posed this question in a different thread, but it was never answered) on what doctrines, policies, or facets of government do republicans differ from libertarians?

Well Republicans lately have been very big on morality laws and restricting liberties for security, libertarians hate that. Socially they're very "liberal", pro drugs, pro free speech, pro privacy, things like that. They're VERY big on civil liberties.

Republicans nowadays also like to screw around a lot as far as foreign policy is concerned. Libertarians would withdraw almost completely from geopolitics. They would still engage in trade and dialogue with other nations, but would likely withdraw/ignore things like the U.N., WTO, World Bank, etc. They would end the war in Iraq Afganistan, and probably pull our troops from South Korea and Germany just for good measure.

Also though most republicans like to talk about small government, not many of them have been backing it up. Libertarians would see most of the services government provides be taken care of by the private sector, things like education, transportation, even things like welfare and social security.

Libertarians are also very big on the whole free-market, free-trade things. They would see very little restrictions on how businesses operate, would lower taxes dramatically, and would abolish all protectionist trade policies.

For what its worth, this isn't the kind of ideology i see the Republican party adopting, IF there is a move toward libertarianism, i think it will focus on the things i mentioned in the first two paragraphs, the issues from the second two paragraphs aren't as popular right now.