Spanish parliament extends rights to apes

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by motivez

But we're not raw predator though, we have the ability to thinks about ethics and morality, which is what's being applied here.

Ethics and morality is debatable when it comes to protecting human life. What do you think happens to chimps in the wild? I assure you their deaths by leopards are quite often more inhuman than anything we could do to them in a lab.

What about the treatment of chickens, cows, livestock, etc that we eat? Is that any more inhumane?

If I had the option of a suffering chimp or a suffering human, sorry chimp.. you're lower on the food chain. My loved one comes first.

[motivez]

I dunno, their deaths by leopards are quick, they aren't forced to live for years in poor conditions, suffering through the hardships of the worst human diseases..

If I had to pick whether I'd die through a long, horrible process or quickly, I'd pick the quick method for sure. I'm sure you would rather your loved ones pass quickly instead of suffering and living in pain for years if their deaths were imminent.

I'm all for treating livestock humanely. I'm not against slaughtering animals for food so long as it's done humanely, but I think when it comes to a species that's so similar to us in particular, we have to take a hard look at how we treat them.. and what we're willing to do to them.

Young Chimps Top Adult Humans In Numerical Memory

I mean, they aren't dumb creatures. They use tools, have family units, and are 96% (if I remember right) similar to us in DNA.. the idea that we can (and should) toss morality and ethics aside in their treatment is pretty disturbing to me.

[Schrödinger's Cat]

What do you guys think about this?

In my opinion, this is a good thing. Human beings are not only animals and mammals, but we are also apes. It is good to see our evolutionary brothers get some rights to life.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by motivez

I dunno, their deaths by leopards are quick, they aren't forced to live for years in poor conditions, suffering through the hardships of the worst human diseases..

If I had to pick whether I'd die through a long, horrible process or quickly, I'd pick the quick method for sure. I'm sure you would rather your loved ones pass quickly instead of suffering and living in pain for years if their deaths were imminent.

I'm all for treating livestock humanely. I'm not against slaughtering animals for food so long as it's done humanely, but I think when it comes to a species that's so similar to us in particular, we have to take a hard look at how we treat them.. and what we're willing to do to them.

Young Chimps Top Adult Humans In Numerical Memory

I mean, they aren't dumb creatures. They use tools, have family units, and are 96% (if I remember right) similar to us in DNA.. the idea that we can (and should) toss morality and ethics aside in their treatment is pretty disturbing to me.

I never said they were dumb or that they weren't very similar to us in DNA. But they are not us, they do not have our intelligence and they are animals very much like other primates. The fact that their DNA is so close to ours makes them prime subjects for testing. I would rather a few thousand chimps suffer from hepatitis if it means we don't infect thousands of humans and we learn how to treat those who have it. I would rather thousands of chimps die of AIDS if it means millions of humans in the world can live a manageable life with the disease. It sucks for the chimp, but my priorities are for the betterment of our species. If I had to choose between my loved one suffering and/or dying or having that pain transposed on a chimp in medical testing, by all means I'd choose the chimp. Sorry chimp, but humans come first. And by not wanting testing on chimps we're basically sentencing the pain and grief they would have received on to humans.

[avsp]

I quite like the idea of rights for animals, as the default position.

Medical experiments are trickier, basically I'd favour it if each experiment required approval from a committe to ensure that it was truely worthwhile & likely to be useful

As for meat, eggs, milk etc not just the death its the life they lead. It takes some effort to imagine anything crueller than the typical battery chicken farm