Reid plan splits Dems

[JaJae]

Harry Reid split with his party to join the 70% of Americans who support expanding US oil production. He proposed a bill that would allow for exploration of oil in the Gulf of Mexico and much of offshore Alaska. Why didn't it go through? Because a group of influential Democrats stopped it.

A group of influential Senate and House Democrats has sided with environmental groups against Reid to call exploration in new areas unnecessary.

The legislation, drafted by Reid and Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee Chairman Jeff Bingaman (D-N.M.), would open nearly a billion new acres off the coast of Alaska to study for drilling. It would also dramatically accelerate oil leases in the western and central Gulf of Mexico.

TheHill.com - Reid plan splits Dems

Keep in mind the article doesn't state they have a majority vote or even a widely accepted position. It's just a few of the old school Democrats (like Pelosi) holding this up and preventing the government from doing its job. When Pelosi promised oversight did she really mean she would give herself the final say on whether any bill can even be brought up to a vote or even discussed? In the meantime the Republicans are fed up. With less than 20 legislative days left and Pelosi et al preventing a vote on this, the Republicans have said no more.

Republicans are demanding votes on several amendments and have pledged to block Democrats from moving to other issues until drilling receives floor votes.

Reid has attempted to throw in $10 billion in hopes of getting past the obstructing of the GOP. However, the Republicans are actively working against the pork and trying to prevent it from passing. This is a smart move before the election, but let's face it, not too long ago they'd be all over it.
Washington Times - Bill jeered as omnibus earmark full of pork

The legislation lumps nearly 40 separate bills into one and authorizes numerous "earmarks," the targeted spending for projects that Democrats often ridiculed as pork-barrel when they swept into power 18 months ago.

Critics are even more concerned about the way all this spending might be approved. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, Nevada Democrat, is threatening to use a parliamentary tactic known as "filling the tree," which would preclude amendments and make it difficult for lawmakers and the White House to block projects they consider wasteful.

The bill is an example of government's inclination "to throw money and create a credit card and charge it to our kids," said Sen. Tom Coburn, Oklahoma Republican, who is leading efforts to thwart a vote on the legislation.

Reid spokesman Jim Manley said Democrats need to consider such a tactic to counter Mr. Coburn's "unprecedented obstructionism" in placing a hold on many of the individual bills so they could not be rushed through the Senate.

This coincides with another thread I made where I predicted the reason the Dems were waiting so long was in part so they could push through all their pet projects and prevent the Republicans from voting against their bills and pork. Most of the pork in this bill is being taken as a bribe to vote on other bills since a lot of it is for fairly neutral stuff that would help the GOP as well as the Democrats in their home districts if passed. However, the GOP thankfully is taking the high road (for now) and saying no thanks.

I predict oil is going to be a major concern in the upcoming elections and the GOP is focused on making it a key component to their campaign. Most Americans agree with the GOP on this issue and most Americans are tired of the pork. If the Democrats don't put Pelosi on a leash or at least tame her in some way that she can go along with her party the Democrats may come into November on the high ground. However, if this continues they'll only be hurting themselves when the voters get to decide who they want representing them in '08 and finally '10. People pay attention to politics mostly for the presidential elections. What happens now will have some value 2 years from now. Pelosi being from one of the most liberal districts in the nation has little to fear, but she's going to be bringing down many of her colleagues if she keeps this up.

Reid is doing what many Democrats need to be done for their districts. However, the Democratic party is being controlled by a small minority of powerful and usually corrupt politicians. Energy is going to become a hot button issue. I expect more infighting and sparring over this issue as we come into the elections and Democrats start focusing on their re-election over towing the Pelosi line. There have already been reports that Democrats have been approaching Coburn asking what they can do to circumvent Pelosi to bring oil exploration to a vote.

[Donkey®]

Originally Posted by JaJae

Harry Reid split with his party to join the 70% of Americans who support expanding US oil production. He proposed a bill that would allow for exploration of oil in the Gulf of Mexico and much of offshore Alaska. Why didn't it go through? Because a group of influential Democrats stopped it.


TheHill.com - Reid plan splits Dems

Keep in mind the article doesn't state they have a majority vote or even a widely accepted position. It's just a few of the old school Democrats (like Pelosi) holding this up and preventing the government from doing its job. When Pelosi promised oversight did she really mean she would give herself the final say on whether any bill can even be brought up to a vote or even discussed? In the meantime the Republicans are fed up. With less than 20 legislative days left and Pelosi et al preventing a vote on this, the Republicans have said no more.



Reid has attempted to throw in $10 billion in hopes of getting past the obstructing of the GOP. However, the Republicans are actively working against the pork and trying to prevent it from passing. This is a smart move before the election, but let's face it, not too long ago they'd be all over it.
Washington Times - Bill jeered as omnibus earmark full of pork


This coincides with another thread I made where I predicted the reason the Dems were waiting so long was in part so they could push through all their pet projects and prevent the Republicans from voting against their bills and pork. Most of the pork in this bill is being taken as a bribe to vote on other bills since a lot of it is for fairly neutral stuff that would help the GOP as well as the Democrats in their home districts if passed. However, the GOP thankfully is taking the high road (for now) and saying no thanks.

I predict oil is going to be a major concern in the upcoming elections and the GOP is focused on making it a key component to their campaign. Most Americans agree with the GOP on this issue and most Americans are tired of the pork. If the Democrats don't put Pelosi on a leash or at least tame her in some way that she can go along with her party the Democrats may come into November on the high ground. However, if this continues they'll only be hurting themselves when the voters get to decide who they want representing them in '08 and finally '10. People pay attention to politics mostly for the presidential elections. What happens now will have some value 2 years from now. Pelosi being from one of the most liberal districts in the nation has little to fear, but she's going to be bringing down many of her colleagues if she keeps this up.

Most Americans are sick of Bush, his war and his deficit. Pork and this nonsense aren't on their lists of "what's wrong."

Right or wrong, it's too granular for most Americans.

[Scrum]

I don't understand why they want to open up drilling in all these new areas.
The way i understand it, they have barely used any of the areas that they have had access to for years.

This is a fake issue to try and blame Democrats for the high prices.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Scrum

I don't understand why they want to open up drilling in all these new areas.
The way i understand it, they have barely used any of the areas that they have had access to for years.

This is a fake issue to try and blame Democrats for the high prices.

The Democrats and environmentalists won't allow them to drill in the profitable areas now. The GOP right now knows the Dems won't allow us to drill, they're looking to explore to see what our options are. And by finding new oil reserves it will have an effect on prices. It really can't hurt to look, however, it is views as a stepping stone to drilling they're trying to stop it.

[Schrödinger's Cat]

I'm convinced that neither party really wants to fix the problem. It's too much of a "hot button issue".

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by JaJae

The Democrats and environmentalists won't allow them to drill in the profitable areas now. The GOP right now knows the Dems won't allow us to drill, they're looking to explore to see what our options are. And by finding new oil reserves it will have an effect on prices. It really can't hurt to look, however, it is views as a stepping stone to drilling they're trying to stop it.

They haven't drilled all the areas that they have current contracts for. Why should we open up even more to them?

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Scrum

They haven't drilled all the areas that they have current contracts for. Why should we open up even more to them?

The states are preventing it in most places where they can or the places aren't as valuable. I'm sure 6Speed would have more info.

[JaJae]

Just as a side note, but another thing Reid agreed to allow the Republicans to get a vote on was more nuclear power plants. That too was shut down before it ever happened.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Most Americans are sick of Bush, his war and his deficit. Pork and this nonsense aren't on their lists of "what's wrong."

Right or wrong, it's too granular for most Americans.

Bush isn't up for re-election no matter how many parallels we can make with McCain. The Democrats need to get off the anti-Bush bandwagon if they want to win this election. It didn't win for them 4 years ago when Bush was running, it sure isn't gonna work for them now.

[Donkey®]

Originally Posted by JaJae

Bush isn't up for re-election no matter how many parallels we can make with McCain. The Democrats need to get off the anti-Bush bandwagon if they want to win this election. It didn't win for them 4 years ago when Bush was running, it sure isn't gonna work for them now.

But it worked in the mid-term elections for Congress. If we're going by trends, it's looking up for them.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Most Americans are sick of Bush, his war and his deficit. Pork and this nonsense aren't on their lists of "what's wrong."

Right or wrong, it's too granular for most Americans.

So Bush's deficit is a problem but democrat spending isn't? What the fuck am I missing here?

[Donkey®]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

So Bush's deficit is a problem but democrat spending isn't? What the fuck am I missing here?

He does have veto authority which he doesn't seem to want to use. So it's not just "The Democrats" spending. The Democrats have been in power for what, a year and some change and they are to blame for this mess? People don't have that short of a memory. Also, while you and I know there's more to how the spending works...most Americans are politically and economically stupid and only see those high level points I made earlier. I also don't blame the Democrats for not doing anything to improve the situation Bush is in. He's going down as the most financially irresponsible....and frankly...the worst president in history. It's called "politics" and I think they are playing the game the way the Republicans have been playing it for quite some time, dirty.

With that said...IF Obama wins in the election, they can't continue to do all this.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Donkey®

He does have veto authority which he doesn't seem to want to use. So it's not just "The Democrats" spending. The Democrats have been in power for what, a year and some change and they are to blame for this mess? People don't have that short of a memory. Also, while you and I know there's more to how the spending works...most Americans are politically and economically stupid and only see those high level points I made earlier. I also don't blame the Democrats for not doing anything to improve the situation Bush is in. He's going down as the most financially irresponsible....and frankly...the worst president in history. It's called "politics" and I think they are playing the game the way the Republicans have been playing it for quite some time, dirty.

With that said...IF Obama wins in the election, they can't continue to do all this.

So they do not have an obligation to look out for the nation if a republican is in office? Thats basically their entire platform they ran on in 2006. Make government transparent, cut the spending, get out of Iraq and not a single thing has happened, to say they're doing it to screw bush is just flat wrong. THey're doing it because now they have power and dont give a shit about their promises or the country, just maintaining that power this election cycle.

Unfortunately the american people have only a handful of people looking out for them, the majority look out for themselves the country be damned.

[Scrum]

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

Unfortunately the american people have only a handful of people looking out for them, the majority look out for themselves the country be damned.

So you're saying that we live in a libertarian utopia?

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Donkey®

He does have veto authority which he doesn't seem to want to use.

Bush has been using his veto and threats of veto quite often actually. I think this is an inaccurate statement. When the GOP had control and was spending like crazy he didn't seem to mind. But for the past couple years he has been throwing the veto around like candy.

[Donkey®]

Originally Posted by JaJae

Bush has been using his veto and threats of veto quite often actually. I think this is an inaccurate statement. When the GOP had control and was spending like crazy he didn't seem to mind. But for the past couple years he has been throwing the veto around like candy.

You can't be serious? 12 vetoes is throwing it around? I would have thought if he was trying to cut spending it would have been thrown around slightly more than that. Oh, and if you look at the shit he's attempted to veto, they aren't all exactly spending bills.

[JaJae]

Originally Posted by Donkey®

You can't be serious? 12 vetoes is throwing it around? I would have thought if he was trying to cut spending it would have been thrown around slightly more than that. Oh, and if you look at the shit he's attempted to veto, they aren't all exactly spending bills.

He's threatened to veto twice that when it came to spending bills in hopes of getting the numbers down. Before bills hit his desk he lets Congress know the magic number that if they go over he'll veto. He's shown numerous times that he's serious by vetoing the bills that go over. And Congress knows he's serious so they've tried to keep it under control. Even still, spending continues to increase with the Democratic Congress.

He's been very liberal with the use of the veto when bills don't meet his standards and he has been threatening vetos left and right forcing Congress to rework bills.

[JaJae]

Democrats will likely propose a continuing resolution to extend funding for the government through the end of the calendar year without making major changes. This bill will certainly include a continuation of the drilling ban — Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D., Calif.), a zealous opponent of offshore drilling since the 1980s, has resisted all attempts to change it.

Democrats are sufficiently committed to maintaining the ban that they could even be willing to force a government shutdown in September, or dare the Republicans to force one. But if Republicans are equally committed to increasing the domestic-energy supply, and President Bush is willing to use his veto pen, they have a golden opportunity.

David Freddoso on Dems & Gas Prices on National Review Online

This is exactly what I've been saying.

[WickedLou9]

As I understand it, we already have millions of acres of land approved for drilling which the oil companies have not yet begun to explore. It seems like we would just be adding imaginary capacity. They havn't even utilized all of the land that they can already drill on... if we grant access to more land what will happen? It seems symbolic to me. Oh lets open more land for drilling. It won't help anything. Why even bother doing it? Political Theatre?