Russia invades Georgia with tank convey

[DosEquis]

Originally Posted by motivez

Looks like Russia has taken control of Gori, effectively splitting Georgia into two..

Again, this is about the oil and control over the supply routes, not defending any sect of people it saw as being persecuted. Their motivation is not noble, it's about power and control that it has seen slip away as former Soviet Republicans decide to side with the west.

How can we bust their balls without looking like goatse.cx though? They executed this to perfection with a play from our playbook. Invade a country of strategic interest in the name of freedom. We took Iraq, they are taking Georgia.

[Schrödinger's Cat]

The Associated Press: Russian troops roll into strategic Georgian city

Russian troops roll into strategic Georgian city

By CHRISTOPHER TORCHIA and MATTI FRIEDMAN – 52 minutes ago
OUTSIDE GORI, Georgia (AP) — Russian troops and paramilitaries rolled into the strategic Georgian city of Gori on Wednesday, apparently violating a truce designed to end the conflict that has uprooted tens of thousands and scarred the Georgian landscape.

In Washington, President Bush said the United States planned a massive humanitarian effort involving American ships and aircraft, includiung a C-17 military cargo plane loaded with supplies that landed on Wednesday.
He said Russia must ensure that "all lines of communication and transport, including seaports, roads and airports," remain open to let deliveries and civilians through.

Georgian officials said Gori, a central hub on Georgia's main east-west highway, was looted and bombed by the Russians before they left later in the day and camped nearby.

Moscow denied the accusations, but it appeared to be on a technicality: a BBC reporter in Gori reported that Russians tanks were in the streets as their South Ossetian separatist allies seized Georgian cars, looted Georgian homes and then set some homes ablaze.

"Russia has treacherously broken its word," Georgia's Security Council chief Alexander Lomaia said Wednesday in Tbilisi, the capital.

An AP reporter saw dozens of trucks and armored vehicles leaving Gori, roaring southeast. Soldiers waved at journalists and one soldier jokingly shouted to a photographer: "Come with us, beauty, we're going to Tbilisi!"

Continued: Here

[Smull]

Say what you want about the "free media" but CNN just had a piece with a correspondent from Moscow who gave the Russian side of the story which sounded an awful lot like what you've been saying. basically that A.) Georgia started it B.) They were defending Russian people and peacekeepers and C.) that America was complicit

[C4Casey]

Well, it sounds like the "peace-keeping" Russians are letting para-militaries pillage and burn Georgian cities. They've essentially sacked Gori. When the fuck was the last time a European city was sacked?

No War, No Peace in Georgia | OneWorld.net (U.S.)

[kombayn]

Originally Posted by Smull

Say what you want about the "free media" but CNN just had a piece with a correspondent from Moscow who gave the Russian side of the story which sounded an awful lot like what you've been saying. basically that A.) Georgia started it B.) They were defending Russian people and peacekeepers and C.) that America was complicit

Georgia fucked up attacking South Ossetia. But, man did Russia show their true colors after all this. They're on everyones radar once again, and that's not a good thing for their country.

[Charles Martel]

I'll bet lunch our troops sit in envy of this Russian attack on Georgia. Not in the manner in which the war is fought. Not with the technology used, nor with the fortitude shown by our unmatched military. It is the Russian troops' process of shooting openly at the western media...I mean that's gotta be an everyday impulse one must remain calm, cool, and collected with a finger near the trigger.

But endeavors on the ground in Iraq and with the media and others lying about your motives and reality on a daily basis.......man. I mean everyone else gets a shot! The terrorists get free reign, the Russians can shoot them, they can get kidnapped like Daniel Pearl...no one bats an eyelash. The American flag flaps in the face of some of these 'news' reporters scratching a cheek of a liberal and it's an international crisis!

[Charles Martel]

Originally Posted by DosEquis

How can we bust their balls without looking like goatse.cx though? They executed this to perfection with a play from our playbook. Invade a country of strategic interest in the name of freedom. We took Iraq, they are taking Georgia.

Georgia ain't Iraq...is why?

However, should the US act unilaterally....not even bother with the UN...concern themselves not with a referendum or public opinion poll and just mow people and media down such as Russia is today busy doing to former Soviet States over disputes like this one between Georgia and South Ossetia....would you be as 'forgiving?'

The United States sneezes on a detainee right and we hear screaming from on high and all night. Russia runs wonton through Georgia like General Sherman did over a century ago in the US and where is the outrage.

Is Russia concerned with international feelings here? Worried their image abroad will be tarnished? Where are the European leaders on this, Sarkozy seems to be the only one even awake!

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by motivez

Russia May Focus on Pro-U.S. Ukraine After Georgia



Bloomberg.com: Worldwide

Did I not call it

This is about control of energy resources, because once they lock up the resources in the region they'll have Europe by the balls. Iran, China and Russia can then attempt to run batshit insane over the rest of the planet. In the meantime we're doing nothing. This in my opinion is a far bigger threat than terrorist from muslim extremists. This is the type of threat that really could put us in the middle of another cold war or God forbid a real all out war.

[C4Casey]

Is still think we'll go to war with Russia if they invade the Ukraine. I mean, invading an ally of 4.9 million people will make us say "shame on you". Invading an energy rich ally of 50+ million people will force us to take military action.

[C4Casey]

Sounds like the Ukraine is already expecting Russia to try something.

In Ukraine, fear of being a resurgent Russia's next target - International Herald Tribune

Ukraine offers missile warning system to Europe - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation)

[JaJae]

Russia is bringing in more missiles and arming their fleet with nukes. It looks like we could be in for another Cold War or even worse.

[Joe Castro]

Originally Posted by C4Casey

Sounds like the Ukraine is already expecting Russia to try something.

Don't count on it. The President is trying to whip up anti Russian sentiment in an attempt to save his job. But it wont work. Mark my words, next year Ukraine will have a new President - Prime Minister Yulia Tymoshenko and she will not use Russian hatred to consolidate power.

[C4Casey]

Considering Russia has cut off energy supplies to the Ukaine in the past and also launched a major cyber attack on Estonia's government, I think their fears are perfectly legitimate.

[DosEquis]

Originally Posted by Charles Martel

Georgia ain't Iraq...is why?

However, should the US act unilaterally....not even bother with the UN...concern themselves not with a referendum or public opinion poll and just mow people and media down such as Russia is today busy doing to former Soviet States over disputes like this one between Georgia and South Ossetia....would you be as 'forgiving?'

The United States sneezes on a detainee right and we hear screaming from on high and all night. Russia runs wonton through Georgia like General Sherman did over a century ago in the US and where is the outrage.

Is Russia concerned with international feelings here? Worried their image abroad will be tarnished? Where are the European leaders on this, Sarkozy seems to be the only one even awake!

Its like Iraq in that these countries were invaded to "liberate" a people.

Russia might do that to countries but we dont. We maintain a structure of diplomacy and allies, we are peace first but fight as a last resort. We care about what other people think because we are not out to take over the world. It is not our job to go out and start wars to install democracy with our weapons.

Because Russia does shit like that, is what makes them Russia. We do things the right way (or supposed to) because we are the United States and people look up to us.

[Joe Castro]

Originally Posted by DosEquis

Because Russia does shit like that, is what makes them Russia. We do things the right way (or supposed to) because we are the United States and people look up to us.

I hate to burst your bubble, but the world hates your country (even more than my own).

Cuba
Iran
Vietnam
Guatemala
Grenada
Nicaragua
Iraq

They are not examples of force being a last option.

[DosEquis]

Originally Posted by Joe Castro

I hate to burst your bubble, but the world hates your country (even more than my own).

Cuba
Iran
Vietnam
Guatemala
Grenada
Nicaragua
Iraq

They are not examples of force being a last option.

I will be on of the first to admit this country has an imperialist agenda. Unfortunately when I do I am considered "unpatriotic".

[Joe Castro]

Originally Posted by DosEquis

I will be on of the first to admit this country has an imperialist agenda. Unfortunately when I do I am considered "unpatriotic".

When people do that it is a sure fire sign they have run out of arguments. Surely it is more patriotic to support your country when it does good and is just and criticise it and push for change when it is not. Unconditional support for your country's every action is not patriotism or loyalty. The Germans who supported the Nazi's were not patriotic, those who questioned and opposed them and their wrongful acts were.

[DosEquis]

"Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship. ...voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

[Joe Castro]

Originally Posted by DosEquis

"Naturally, the common people don't want war; neither in Russia nor in England nor in America, nor for that matter in Germany. That is understood. But, after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship. ...voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country."

A favourite of mine, even given who said it.