Originally Posted by kinggovernor we don't want the military to get involved in politics Why not politics seems to have no problem in getting involved and misapropriating the military for it's own goals. I don't think the military should really be questioning that much. If you told to do an ...
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10-03-2006, 09:59 PM
| #41 | ||||
| Baka  Idealist Adelaide, Australia 
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor Why not politics seems to have no problem in getting involved and misapropriating the military for it's own goals.
I don't think the military should really be questioning that much. If you told to do an operation and you believe it cannot be carried out with the given resources and the government says "do it anyway", then perhaps you need to speak out. The problem is politics cares only for politics. | ||||
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10-03-2006, 10:07 PM
| #42 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator  Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by Kytro that has been going on since there was organized militaries and leaders of those militaries
1. Complain and then get told to stfu 2. STFU and accomplish the mission with the resources you have
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10-03-2006, 10:10 PM
| #43 | ||||
| Baka Idealist Adelaide, Australia
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor What if there simply are not enough resources, or the plan is not going to work.
If they said "take over that nation by yourself" it ain't gonna happen. So when high-level people have significant doubts they should be making it known as a last resort. After all ignoring the experts can be dangerous, and sometimes politicans hear only what they want to hear. Originally Posted by kinggovernor Which is why wars have limited lifespans.
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10-03-2006, 10:14 PM
| #44 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by Kytro if the generals felt that there was not enough manpower to invade iraq, then they should have resigned in protest. That would have been the honorable thing to do. But we took over that country in record time, maybe they could have planned more for post war operations
 I wasn't there I don't know how it went down.
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10-03-2006, 10:16 PM
| #45 | ||||
| Baka Idealist Adelaide, Australia
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor Typically though the people are mainpualted by politicans.
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10-03-2006, 11:01 PM
| #46 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by Kytro only if they let politicans do that
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10-03-2006, 11:04 PM
| #47 | ||||
| Baka Idealist Adelaide, Australia
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor If they are well informed, then yes. Not everyone is. That and advertising works.
A big budget will get you further than a good policy. It can also overcome previous failures. | ||||
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10-03-2006, 11:36 PM
| #48 | ||||
| One American Family at a Time.  Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor
I prioritize our country's welfare as higher than someone's single career. | ||||
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10-04-2006, 12:37 AM
| #49 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland explain how this improves our country's welfare?
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10-04-2006, 01:11 AM
| #50 | ||||
| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor Isn't Truth the greater good? Do you want to live in a country that bases their actions on lies and deceit?
If the Generals are seeing our servicemen sent to their deaths, for no good reason, it's their responsibility as HUMANS to speak up about it. General after General has come out at this point, and they are all painting a different picture than the administration. The Generals are the one's that are more directly part of the warfare, not Bush. Why would I believe Bush over them? He has no credibility anymore. The Military is for the People. It's for the citizens, not the politicians. The most fundamental improvement for the country's welfare is for this to remain a constant steadfast truth. | ||||
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10-04-2006, 08:38 AM
| #51 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland they have "come out" after they have retired, if they really thought that everything was fucked up they should have resigned immediately.
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10-04-2006, 09:27 AM
| #52 | ||||
| Baka Idealist Adelaide, Australia
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor Ideally, but people I guess they have thier reasons.
maybe money, maybe they believed they could do some good. | ||||
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10-04-2006, 05:12 PM
| #53 | ||||
| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor I can identify with their situation. Not on that scale naturally...
I was part of an Organization, and my powers to change things were very limited, but I thought if I just stayed, maybe I could make a difference. And i clung to the hope that if I toughed it out, the leadership would see it different, or things would change. And it never did. I am sure many of these retired generals felt similar, except in their case, the people under them are DYING and the people above them ARE NOT LISTENING. Do they stay and try to save them, or leave so another General can take over, and then the cycle begins, all the while more die....that's a shitty situation. | ||||
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10-04-2006, 06:59 PM
| #54 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland they were THE leadership; if several of them had resigned because they said that someone not in the military was forcing them to send an unprepared military to war or whatever then shit would have changed. But they did not; if the war had been a huge succuess (which it was the beginning and no one was "speaking out"
 ) then they would have said nothing. | ||||
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10-04-2006, 11:01 PM
| #55 | ||||
| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor They aren't the leadership...is not the President COMMANDER IN CHIEF? Don't they take orders? They all take Orders. And while they are in the Military, they are supposed to take orders, and they aren't supposed to question their leadership. So they retire and then speak out.
They would have nothing to say if the goal was attainable. The goal of overthrowing a country are pretty defined, and they did that. And now, the new goal, is to stabilize the country....not so defined. | ||||
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10-04-2006, 11:10 PM
| #56 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland that is like the CFO of a company saying...........well I knew we were cooking the books but I just take orders from the CEO.
They can resign and retire, generals are already pass the minimum age for retirement. The new goal is defined, make the country able to stand on its own two feet | ||||
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10-05-2006, 02:26 AM
| #57 | ||||
| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by kinggovernor The standards for the goal differ. This isn't a concrete goal. That's like me saying that I'll be happy when I'm financially stable. Yeah, like when is that actually going to happen? My standards for financially stable are different than yours, and different from everyone's.
Yeah, they CAN resign, and they CAN retire...but I'm sure you could see why they would stay in, and do what they do, even if they actually disagree with it. | ||||
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10-05-2006, 04:55 AM
| #58 | ||||
| America Fuck Yea Election Moderator Republican In Name Only
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland to be part of what you consider a bogus plan and to not speak or resign in protest and then suddenly three years later you have a problem with it is a pretty weak position IMO
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10-05-2006, 11:59 AM
| #59 | |||
| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
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