Why people make such a big deal about this baffles me in the same way anti-gay marriage folks baffle me...in either case, I don't see how it makes any difference in my life, so I don't give a shit. I can't get my head around why anyone would care about ...
10-08-2006, 02:46 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative  Realist 
| Why do you care if people don't speak English? Why people make such a big deal about this baffles me in the same way anti-gay marriage folks baffle me...in either case, I don't see how it makes any difference in my life, so I don't give a shit. I can't get my head around why anyone would care about something which doesn't affect their lives. But I'm guessing people will argue non English speakers will affect their lives. But how? You went to the Burger King drive through and the girl at the window had a hard time with English? That doesn't seem to be a language issue to me. That's an issue of incompetent management who didn't hire someone who was qualified. I've also heard people complain about hiring contractors or whatever and had a hard time communicating with them. Well in that case, why the fuck did you hire someone you couldn't communicate with?! Again, it just seems to me this is a non issue, and people who act like it affects them negatively are just whiners looking for something to complain about. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 02:51 PM
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| One American Family at a Time.  Idealist The OC, California
| My beef with the Non-English, is that they have no desire to learn or assimilate into American culture, and English is a part of that. They don't raise their children to speak English, and then when they get to school, WE have to PAY for them to LEARN English, because their parents don't. When you go to other countries, like MEXICO, or FRANCE, or OTHERS, to live, you have to learn their language. Because they don't accomidate. We shouldn't either. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 03:07 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland Again, I don't see how this affects your life. So what if they don't want to learn English or teach their kids English? Of what consequence is that to you? It may be a detriment to kids if they're not taught English, but that's their problem, not yours...and besides, they'll go to public school and learn English either way, so it's really not an issue. If an adult doesn't want to learn English, he'll have limited options, which, again, is his problem, not yours.
And regarding other countries...it's really only a minority of countries which don't accomodate. It's a fact that you can travel to many places around the world and get by simply with English. Most people around the world speak more than one language. It's only Americans and a few other countries who shit themselves at the thought of *gasp* learning another language. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 03:33 PM
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| ..... your a worthless poster  Realist
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo Americans don't shit themselves at the thought of learning another language. The fact is we don't NEED to use another language so what incentive is there to learn another language?
I only care about english because my son's school had to hire another teacher for the sole purpose of teaching spanish speaking kids english. That's MY money that could have gone to supplies, teacher salaries, new books, etc. Other than that, if I can't find someone who speaks english I leave the store. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 03:40 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by 7960 Yeah, you're right. I should've said Americans shit themselves at the thought of their virgin ears being exposed to a foreign language in their own country.
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10-08-2006, 04:24 PM
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| Never, never, never give up  Conservative Party High Point, NC
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo
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10-08-2006, 04:34 PM
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| ..... your a worthless poster Realist
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo Again, no. Just like the french expect people to speak french and the germans expect people to speak german, americans expect people to speak english. It's our de facto national language...I expect it to be spoken where ever I go. If it's not, I leave. Very simple.
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10-08-2006, 04:42 PM
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| The Bydo Empire must die! Independent
| Originally Posted by Spicy McVoodoo It's not foreign language itself that's offensive. If all prexisting americans had to go out of their way to learn every new language coming in from overseas immigrants, nothing would ever be accomplished. It takes YEARS to truely master a new language as an adult, and that's if the person is intelligent. We NEED a standardized language so citizens can have the reasonable expectation of reliable communication without having to reinvent the wheel every decade or so. As a result, a society that knows and uses one language well is far more efficient and stable than one that has to learn 15 languages half-assed out of simple political correctness. Most other countries have similar requirements for immigration for the same reasons, so I see no reason why we shouldn't do the same. By all means, speak whatever language you want, but you can't expect others to understand you unless it is the defacto language of the area, ie english in this case.
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10-08-2006, 04:57 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by R-Type What Mexican expects everyone to understand Spanish? This is a total fantasy in the minds of culture warriors.
I've encountered plenty of Mexicans illegal and some legal who spoke very little English, and invariably they were very shy about speaking at all and did their best to avoid any type of service where they knew English would be a problem. The idea of some Mexican demanding you learn Spanish and demanding the entire country change to accomodate him does not exist in reality. If they don't learn English, it's not going to affect you. If anything, they'll just lower their own quality of life. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 05:18 PM
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| Never, never, never give up Conservative Party High Point, NC
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo Holy crap dude. You keep saying this and people keep pointing out why it's wrong. Re-read the posts and let it sink in for once.
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10-08-2006, 05:20 PM
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| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo It affect my child when he goes to school and 90% of his kindergarten class is busy learning English instead of actual LEARNING. He doesn't need to be taught English because he already knows it.
Have you ever seen the episode of ER (OLD OLD episode) where the woman OD'd on some medication because it said "TAKE ONCE DAILY" and ONCE in Spanish means ELEVEN. Um, is that not an issue? The fact is, is that it's a common courtesy that when someone MOVES to another country, that they learn the language that is spoken there, no matter what that language is. We are seriously the only country that this is an issue with. It's been 100 years since we've been a "melting pot", we aren't a melting pot, we are turning into a "pot of beans", at I believe the rate of 2,000 per day. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 05:24 PM
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| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo
 My friend, you need to come to California before you make this thread. Did you know, that if you are on the darker side in California, you are expected to know Spanish? Even if you are a 3rd generation American, the fact that you are dark, and may not know Spanish, opens you up to staunch critisizm (I can't spell today, forgive me) from MANY illegals? If you go to McDonalds, and you are even remotely hispanic looking, they will immediatley speak to you in Spanish? Did you know that in many places, retail, Drs offices, as well as restraunts, it is quite common for mexicans to only speak Spanish to one another? If you don't see the problem with this, then you haven't been living with the problem long enough. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 06:00 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland Why don't they just divide the kids who already speak English from those who don't?
Originally Posted by IminWonderland For me it's not. And frankly, I don't think this is even a language issue. It's a question of stupidity. Even if you don't speak English, you know that the entire label is written in English, so why would one word ("once") be in Spanish? The person who did that just sounds like a retard.
Originally Posted by IminWonderland No we're not. Every country has immigrant populations who are struggling to learn the native language. It's only an issue in America because we're the biggest fucking whiners in the world. The rest of humanity hears other languages in their country and sees it as natural and inevitable. Some Americans hear Spanish and think it's an assault on their lives.
Originally Posted by IminWonderland That may be the case, but once again, why do I care? As far as I can see, none of this affects my life.
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10-08-2006, 06:00 PM
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| The Bydo Empire must die! Independent
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo I'm hardly a culture warrior. If anything, I'm more of a globalist. I'm sure there are mexican nationalists as there are american nationalists as there are german nationalists, etc.. In the case of illegal immigrants from mexico, I am SURE that there are communities of them living in california, new mexico, and texas who have amassed enough members to sustain their own cultural inertia. In that sense, they are the culture warriors, not me. I didn't emigrate to mexico and expect everyone there to learn english.
Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo If mass numbers of them were to move into this country, yes that is what would happen. It is already happening in fact, with double language signs and mandatory spanish in high schools for instance. At 45 I really won't be able to go back and learn spanish just so I can continue to live, work, and be a part of society.
Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo Initially, you're right. However, it WILL lower my quality of life if they emigrate and become the cultural majority in this country as seems to be happening.
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10-08-2006, 06:08 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland Please, I live in Houston, Texas. We're not that different from California with respect to illegals. In fact, Bill O'Rly seems to have taken up the position that Houston has become a sanctuary for illegals. I'm not unaware of what's happening, especially since I've worked in jobs where I've had to deal with illegals and Spanish-only speakers daily.
Originally Posted by IminWonderland Can you offer specifics? What do you mean "expected to know?" Expected to know by whom? And criticism from whom? Who gives a shit. I get criticized by bums for not giving them change on the way to work...is this a national crisis? Does it really mean anything? The fact of the matter is that you don't need Spanish to get by in America, and if you only speak Spanish, you're going to have limited options.
Originally Posted by IminWonderland So fucking what?
 I can't believe that offends you. They're trying to be polite by accomodating people in their preferred language. Would you be pissed if you went to the McDonald's in Paris and the girl spoke to you in English? Originally Posted by IminWonderland Yes, and I could give a shit less what language people speak to each other in when they're speaking among themselves. Sounds to me like more whining about stuff that doesn't affect your life.
Originally Posted by IminWonderland It's not a problem if it doesn't affect my life, and this doesn't.
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10-08-2006, 06:13 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by R-Type The only type of jobs I can see requiring you speak spanish are service type jobs where you have to deal with the completely unfiltered general public. In other words, the type of jobs that a 45 year old probably wouldn't hold anyway.
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10-08-2006, 06:13 PM
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| I DIDNT KNOW THAT  Corpus Christi, Texas
| Tax dollars and a nation's citizens ability to communicate are my concerns. If you choose to speak spanish, I have no issue. I do have issue with the tax dollars used to accommodate those who refuse to assimilate. I also think the strength in a nation is its ability to communicate with each other. I dont care if they dont use English except when needed, but I expect them to know if needed, especially in times of crisis. You may think it doesnt affect you, but that is only because your focus is on you own world. Believe me through taxation alone, you are directly affected. Last edited by KatKanPlay; 10-08-2006 at 06:22 PM. | ||||
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10-08-2006, 06:43 PM
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| Common Sense Conservative Realist
| Originally Posted by KatKanPlay Well, the tax dollars to accomodate is an interesting issue. I have no idea of the numbers, but what I'd like to know is whether money spent on such things is a good investment. I have no idea whether it is.
At any rate, I disagree with characterizing non English speakers as "refusing to assimilate." I don't think it's really a choice. Certainly if you could ask Spanish speakers in America if they'd like to speak English, they'd say yes. It's just that learning a second language as an adult can be extremely difficult, especially when you don't have the time or resources to learn. It's as if people think you can just press a button and learn a language. I can't help but think this sentiment has a lot to do with many Americans having never learned a second language, and therefore they can't empathize. Originally Posted by KatKanPlay So do I, which is why I don't mind if we become a bilingual society if that's what it takes to have the best communication.
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10-08-2006, 07:20 PM
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