Poll: 54% of Americans think American Dream is Impossible v. what do you think? - Page 2

KatKanPlay · 10-21-2006, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo

This is why it's such BS to say "just work hard and you'll be fine." You can work your job, have your insurance, and then you be ruined suddenly by an illness. But I'm sure some in this thread will find a way to blame it on the people.

Life has a way of bitch slapping self-righteous individuals. Life teaches you to be very careful about pointing fingers.

Diesel66 · 10-21-2006, 11:44 PM

Originally Posted by KatKanPlay

Life has a way of bitch slapping self-righteous individuals. Life teaches you to be very careful about pointing fingers.

but you are pointing fingers

6SpeedTA95 · 10-22-2006, 12:35 AM

Originally Posted by KatKanPlay

Life has a way of bitch slapping self-righteous individuals. Life teaches you to be very careful about pointing fingers.

So pointing out the fact htat much of what goes wrong in our lives is OUR fault is somehow unjustly pointing fingers? That somehow anyone who tells others to analyze themselves before everything else deserve to be bitch slapped by life? Give me a break, people have issues, ultimately its our decisions that for the most part get to or keep us from getting to where we want to guy. I could be making a bitchload more money but ultimately decided against it for a variety of reasons. So its partly my fault that I'm not making 50% or even 100% more money than I am now. I realize this and try to make sure my behavior allows me to sleep at night while at the same time benefitting me and my wife. If something goes wrong I dont point fingers at others or the government, I first look to see if I can/could have handled the situation differently myself. Much of the time our problems are brought on in some form or fashion by ourselves. Many folks dont want to come to grips with that but its true.

JaJae · 10-22-2006, 12:41 AM

Life can throw you curve balls. But ultimately you have more control over your success or failure than your race or the government.

6SpeedTA95 · 10-22-2006, 12:45 AM

Originally Posted by JaJae

Life can throw you curve balls. But ultimately you have more control over your success or failure than your race or the government.

Well said.

IminWonderland · 10-22-2006, 02:16 AM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

So pointing out the fact htat much of what goes wrong in our lives is OUR fault is somehow unjustly pointing fingers? That somehow anyone who tells others to analyze themselves before everything else deserve to be bitch slapped by life? Give me a break, people have issues, ultimately its our decisions that for the most part get to or keep us from getting to where we want to guy. I could be making a bitchload more money but ultimately decided against it for a variety of reasons. So its partly my fault that I'm not making 50% or even 100% more money than I am now. I realize this and try to make sure my behavior allows me to sleep at night while at the same time benefitting me and my wife. If something goes wrong I dont point fingers at others or the government, I first look to see if I can/could have handled the situation differently myself. Much of the time our problems are brought on in some form or fashion by ourselves. Many folks dont want to come to grips with that but its true.

Two roads diverged in a yellow wood,
And sorry I could not travel both
And be one traveler, long I stood
And looked down one as far as I could
To where it bent in the undergrowth;

Then took the other, as just as fair,
And having perhaps the better claim,
Because it was grassy and wanted wear;
Though as for that the passing there
Had worn them really about the same,

And both that morning equally lay
In leaves no step had trodden black.
Oh, I kept the first for another day!
Yet knowing how way leads on to way,
I doubted if I should ever come back.

I shall be telling this with a sigh
Somewhere ages and ages hence:
Two roads diverged in a wood, and I--
I took the one less traveled by,
And that has made all the difference.

-Robert Frost

None of us will ever know which road is going to be the road to the American Dream. We only have a loose idea of what this dream is, and that it's supposed to make us happy in the end.

Fuck the American Dream. I'll just go for what I want instead.

Donkey® · 10-22-2006, 02:22 AM

A lot of you are delusional. It is absolutely and 100% untrue that EVERYONE can acheive it and they only have themselves to blame if they don't. Not only that, wtf IS "The American Dream?" My American Dream would include EVERYONE being able to live comfortably in this country...with no crime...no debt...no war...no hatred...no racism...everyone being able to afford BASIC needs. The "American Dream" most people have is one of self acheivement and self improvement. Fuck everyone else. Most fucking UnAmerican bullshit there could be if you ask me.

IminWonderland · 10-22-2006, 02:35 AM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

A lot of you are delusional. It is absolutely and 100% untrue that EVERYONE can acheive it and they only have themselves to blame if they don't. Not only that, wtf IS "The American Dream?" My American Dream would include EVERYONE being able to live comfortably in this country...with no crime...no debt...no war...no hatred...no racism...everyone being able to afford BASIC needs. The "American Dream" most people have is one of self acheivement and self improvement. Fuck everyone else. Most fucking UnAmerican bullshit there could be if you ask me.

Yeah, sorry but your dream of EVERYONE living comfortably, with no debt, no war, and no hatred, is a socialist Utopia that is constantly shot down.

America is home of the Fuck Everyone Else attitude.

Donkey® · 10-22-2006, 02:38 AM

Originally Posted by IminWonderland

Yeah, sorry but your dream of EVERYONE living comfortably, with no debt, no war, and no hatred, is a socialist Utopia that is constantly shot down.

America is home of the Fuck Everyone Else attitude.

And it is why we are loathed all over the rest of the world. Besides, dreams are supposed to be unacheivable...otherwise they are just goals...and "OMG I OWN THIS AND HAVE THAT" is a selfish one at that.

IminWonderland · 10-22-2006, 02:47 AM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

And it is why we are loathed all over the rest of the world. Besides, dreams are supposed to be unacheivable...otherwise they are just goals...and "OMG I OWN THIS AND HAVE THAT" is a selfish one at that.

I actually quite agree with you. Americans are very self centered. Capatalism is the drug of the self centered. Making Billions upon billions while kids go to bed hungry is selfish.

But, hey the other side on this board will just on on with the "You are responsible for yourself" and so on rhetoric that it excuses the selfish narrow thinking American.

And I believe that too is how the world sees us.

I truely belive a country can only be as great as it's poorest people.

And you are right about the dream part. Dreams are not the same as goals. I think our previous generation put a standard up that worked for the time, because the economy was just right, and so were the people, but that dream has expired in todays world.

Donkey® · 10-22-2006, 03:06 AM

Originally Posted by IminWonderland

I actually quite agree with you. Americans are very self centered. Capatalism is the drug of the self centered. Making Billions upon billions while kids go to bed hungry is selfish.

But, hey the other side on this board will just on on with the "You are responsible for yourself" and so on rhetoric that it excuses the selfish narrow thinking American.

And I believe that too is how the world sees us.

I truely belive a country can only be as great as it's poorest people.

And you are right about the dream part. Dreams are not the same as goals. I think our previous generation put a standard up that worked for the time, because the economy was just right, and so were the people, but that dream has expired in todays world.

I mean, most people see the American Dream as owning a home, a couple of cars, some kids...shit. I can go to the bank any day and come away with both of the first examples and if I wanted kids, I would have not used condoms for my entire life. What kind of dreams are those when someone like me can acheive them in a span of a couple of days? On the flip side, it takes YEARS and even DECADES for some people to acheive something like owning a home. That type of disparity is ridiculous. The haves have set these "dreams" because they are easily acheivable for themselves. Americans by nature are lazy...the white elite is no exception. If it were hard for them they would just make up some other goals and set them as the "dream."

Diesel66 · 10-22-2006, 03:09 AM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

I mean, most people see the American Dream as owning a home, a couple of cars, some kids...shit. I can go to the bank any day and come away with both of the first examples and if I wanted kids, I would have not used condoms for my entire life. What kind of dreams are those when someone like me can acheive them in a span of a couple of days?

So you could have bought a house with your first job ?

Or did it take years of savings credit building to get to your current level ?

Donkey® · 10-22-2006, 03:30 AM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

So you could have bought a house with your first job ?

Or did it take years of savings credit building to get to your current level ?

My situation was a little different. I dropped out of college and went overseas to play basketball...so yes, I could.

IminWonderland · 10-22-2006, 04:08 AM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

So you could have bought a house with your first job ?

Or did it take years of savings credit building to get to your current level ?

The difference is, is that even though he has attained this "dream" he still sees the bigger picture that life is not just about HIM. He remembered he wasn't the only one living in America.

Diesel66 · 10-22-2006, 05:35 AM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

My situation was a little different. I dropped out of college and went overseas to play basketball...so yes, I could.

I understand your argument now.

7th Ninjai · 10-22-2006, 09:00 AM

It is absolutely still possible. I see immigrants come through my wife's office all of the time who originally came here with $1000 and a full family to support. Most are now owners of serveral businesses and are very successful. In fact, my wife and I had dinner at the house of an immigrant last night who owns a construction company in Atlanta. They have a beautiful family and are doing very well for themselves. Everything they now have, they earned within this country.

The problem is, most of us are too complacent with what we have to really be successful (myself included). I hold a corporate IT job where I bring home a good salary, have great benefits, and I work for a company that has high over employee morale. I'm complacent and, unfortunately, not as motivated as I should be to take the step of doing something on my own. My wife and I took the step to open up her own law firm a year ago and it has been bearing fruit for us. I need to overcome my complacency and follow suit.

KatKanPlay · 10-22-2006, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

but you are pointing fingers

The only posts I have made in this thread illuded to the destruction of the American dream due to illness and in many cases insurance offer no safety neat that prevents you from losing you dream no matter how hard you work nor how responsible you are. So who am I pointing fingers at?

Are you self righteous? If you are a christian, then you might want to have your minister explain self-righteousness and the how your Christ looks down on it.

Other than that I was making simple statement of truth and wasnt pointing fingers at anyone.

Diesel66 · 10-22-2006, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by KatKanPlay

Are you self righteous? If you are a christian, then you might want to have your minister explain self-righteousness and the how your Christ looks down on it.

Other than that I was making simple statement of truth and wasnt pointing fingers at anyone.

No on both counts. And the smileys meant it was a joke.

KatKanPlay · 10-22-2006, 10:25 AM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

So pointing out the fact htat much of what goes wrong in our lives is OUR fault is somehow unjustly pointing fingers? That somehow anyone who tells others to analyze themselves before everything else deserve to be bitch slapped by life? Give me a break, people have issues, ultimately its our decisions that for the most part get to or keep us from getting to where we want to guy. I could be making a bitchload more money but ultimately decided against it for a variety of reasons. So its partly my fault that I'm not making 50% or even 100% more money than I am now. I realize this and try to make sure my behavior allows me to sleep at night while at the same time benefitting me and my wife. If something goes wrong I dont point fingers at others or the government, I first look to see if I can/could have handled the situation differently myself. Much of the time our problems are brought on in some form or fashion by ourselves. Many folks dont want to come to grips with that but its true.

My post pointed to one specific issue and the power that one issue has to destroy the American dream. If you had your way, there would be no help whatsoever for those folks who's lives have been destroyed by illness and the American dream has been ripped from their grasp due to circumstances beyond their control. If you see someone in a soup line or using food stamps in the line in front of you at the grocery store, or relying on any government assistance, you cant tell me your first thought isnt that they are worthless and are just simply mooching your tax dollars? Do you EVER push aside your disdain long enough to say to yourself, I dont know their story so I should not pass judgement? Your stand has been pretty clear on this issue. There is no safety net for the medical issue and that was specifically what my posts in this thread have been about.

Until very recently in our country's history, the path to the Ameri