Originally Posted by John Kerry “You know, education, if you make the most of it, if you study hard and do your homework, and you make an effort to be smart, uh, you can do well. If you don’t, you get stuck in Iraq.” This is probably considered a cheap ...
10-31-2006, 01:02 AM
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| Braccae tuae aperiuntur.  Reform Party NJ 
| John Kerry on our lazy, uneducated military Originally Posted by John Kerry This is probably considered a cheap shot against Kerry, but it's not just him. The Democrats seem to be expressing this notion more often lately. Our servicemen in Iraq deserve more from our politicians.
Are there people in Iraq who don't do well in school and decide to join the military? Of course. But it's kind of disrespectful for leaders in the DNC to take the stance of constantly saying it in public for no reason other than to attack the GOP. There's plenty to attack the GOP for without saying our military is full of lazy, uneducated people "stuck" in Iraq. For an "elitist" he certainly has no class. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 01:07 AM
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| Anti-War, Anti-State, Pro-Free Market  Capitalist
| What he said is true, but  he shouldn't have said that. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 01:11 AM
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| where the porn at?  Realist Englewood, CO
| Originally Posted by JaJae how about you post the rest of the quote so we can form an opinion on more than 2 sentences of a 10 minute speech.
im not defending him if he in fact is just throwing it out there, but kerry is a pretty well spoken guy. it would be good to know what the quesion was, as well as what was said directly before and after that statement. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 01:12 AM
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| Braccae tuae aperiuntur. Reform Party NJ
| http://www.kfi640.com/cc-common/mlib...1162269270.mp3 That's all I got. That's the radio station he said it on. This isn't the first time Kerry has made statements like this though. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 01:38 AM
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| where the porn at? Realist Englewood, CO
| Originally Posted by JaJae i think there could be alot more to this statement. it could be him commenting on a general opinion of grunts in the military. it could be him really trashing soldiers, but it really isnt fair to form an opinion on a 6 second sound clip.
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10-31-2006, 01:42 AM
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| Braccae tuae aperiuntur. Reform Party NJ
| Originally Posted by SICKGUY Valid point. And I don't think he was trashing the soldiers. That's not the point. It's the overall perception he has of our soldiers in Iraq. He could have been talking about poor people. He could have been talking about underprivileged, etc.
It's not really what he was talking about that matters to me. It's that fact that he had the audacity to say, if you study hard and make and effort you'll do well. If you don't you essentially end up in the military. It's poor wording and it's becoming more and more common to hear little nuances like this coming from the DNC. Nobody seems to make a big deal about it. But personally I find it kind of rude to our servicemen putting their lives on the line in Iraq. I really do want the DNC to win this upcoming election. But, it's things like this that just piss me off. I can forgive overspending a lot quicker than I can talking down on the personality quality of our soldiers during a time of war. Characterizing people in the military as being the lazy, uneducated doesn't sit right with me. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 02:03 AM
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| One American Family at a Time.  Idealist The OC, California
| I think it's fair to say that they were probably lazy and uneducated when they got there. And that was probably many of the reasons for joining for those individuals. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 02:13 AM
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| where the porn at? Realist Englewood, CO
| Originally Posted by JaJae yeah, but my point is...we dont really know the context of what he was saying.
that station is obviously a conservative outlet with rush limbaugh and dr. laura. should i post a clip of al franken using a 6 second clip of g.w. bush talking about social security?? while im sure franken would do such a thing, it doesnt mean we should post it on here as a way to make our case. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 02:18 AM
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| where the porn at? Realist Englewood, CO
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland i think most guys in infantry are probably the least intelligent of the armed forces, but its not always the case. i scored a 65 on my asvab, was told for months that my job with fire rescue was secured. come my ship date to boot camp, i was still open contract and had a choice between cook and machine gunner, lol. i didnt join the marines to be a cook!
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10-31-2006, 02:37 AM
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| ipsa Scientia Potestas est  Pragmatist North Carolina
| I'd like to see the context as well... and honestly, is he wrong? I believe the number of poor, uneducated people in the military that's doing the grunt work over there is pretty high.. and the military targets these people with the promise of education and money because those are the two things they don't have. I doubt his purpose was to insult the soldiers, but reality is reality. It's [generally] not the rich affluent kids who are signing up to fight in Iraq.. it's the people without other options. And that doesn't mean they're bad or that we shouldn't honor their sacrifice. Whatever their reasons for joining, they're serving their country and we should respect and honor them for it. He probably could have taken the easy road and not said it, we all know that this is going to come back and bite him in the ass at some point, but there's a point to be made about the haves sending the havenots to fight in a war that's become a mistake.. so props to him for making it, even though it doesn't play well to the "fast food politics" crowd. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 02:51 AM
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| One American Family at a Time. Idealist The OC, California
| Originally Posted by SICKGUY Yeah, um KFI is a local station to me, I am wondering now what show that was on....
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10-31-2006, 02:58 AM
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| where the porn at? Realist Englewood, CO
| Originally Posted by IminWonderland this guys...
KFI AM 640 More Stimulating Talk Radio i tried to find the full speech, but its only that sound clip he sure sounds like a guy that can really relate to us everyday folks. i bet he can really relate to those uneducated soldiers in iraq too. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 03:08 AM
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| Last Starfighter  Independent Northern California
| WTF? What he's forgetting is that many people join the military for the Educational Benefits that they offer, and a huge bonus to go to college after they've served because they can't afford it any other way. How the fuck is that being lazy, working to better their lives? John Kerry has always had a poor opinion of the military and has been bashing it since the Vietnam War. Last edited by Diamond Cross; 10-31-2006 at 03:09 AM.. Reason: spelling correction | ||||
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10-31-2006, 03:08 AM
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| Braccae tuae aperiuntur. Reform Party NJ
| Originally Posted by motivez I don't think he's wrong in that some people who join the military had a rough time getting through college, but had the determination to better themselves in other ways. The problem is, it doesn't seem he established his view in that fashion. It was very blunt and not very friendly to our troops overseas risking their lives.
And I would say the majority of people in the military either graduated or haven't attempted college. So he's a bit off base. The military is often a stepping stone for people to be able to afford college. That's the main reason people join... they want to better themselves, but don't have the means on their own. Implying that people who are lazy and don't do well in school join the military is a bit absurd. Most lazy people are terrified of military life. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 03:13 AM
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| Braccae tuae aperiuntur. Reform Party NJ
| Originally Posted by Diamond Cross That's why I have a problem with it. It's not the first time he's said anything. Even during his campaign he had a couple questionable comments. Clinton has made negative comments on the military. Many key leaders of the DNC have made comments. It just seems focused that the Democrats tend to be more likely to say these things. It's tactless.
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10-31-2006, 03:32 AM
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| Common Sense Conservative  Realist
| Originally Posted by JaJae This is really interesting. It's like the elephant in the living room. Everyone knows it, everyone thinks it, but no one is supposed to talk about it.
Anyway, I disagree that he said it for no reason at all than to attack the GOP. How about he's genuinely concerned for the people stuck in Iraq and would like to see people have more options via school? I mean, certainly a lot of parents don't want their kids to feel pressured to go to Iraq for lack of other options, and certainly it has occurred to a lot of soldiers that they might have been better off to stay in school. What is so wrong with a politician echoing that sentiment? It's taboo, apparently... | ||||
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10-31-2006, 03:44 AM
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| wait you said what....  Republican Ewa Beach, HI/ Iraq
| Originally Posted by SICKGUY I'm infantry, I also am an RF Engineer. I have college education. In my 6 years of military over a span of 10 years, I met more enlisted guys with degrees in the infantry than any other job. Most of the infantry are very intelligent people who like doing the tough work. There are some dummies but most guys i know in infantry are quite smart.
About the OP's post. I think that kerry's comment is insensitive but i also would like to hear the whole thing. Taking it for face value i am pretty pissed that someone would think that only dumb people are stuck in iraq. The military is a viable option for people who wish to do better with their life and could not in the civilian world. The military is also an option for very well educated people who choose to serve their country. | ||||
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10-31-2006, 03:45 AM
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| Last Starfighter Independent Northern California
| Because he's not genuinely concerned about our troops. A lot of Veterans are against him. Here's a website to get you started: Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry Here is their grieviances against him, and it's a doozy: Vietnam Veterans Against John Kerry Some of their grieviances: John Kerry, as leader of Vietnam Veterans Against the War, was present at a November 1971 meeting during which his group discussed and debated the possibility of ending the Vietnam War by assassinating U.S. senators who were voting to support the Vietnam War. In 1990-1993 Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs, Kerry, as a co-chairman, used his influence and power "to cover up voluminous evidence that a significant number of live American prisoners—perhaps hundreds—were never acknowledged or returned after the Vietnam War-ending treaty was signed in January 1973." | ||||
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10-31-2006, 03:49 AM
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| wait you said what.... Republican Ewa Beach, HI/ Iraq
| Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo Why does everyone assume that the soldiers are stuck in iraq? Most new soldiers in the military have joined knowing we are at war. Most old soldiers are reenlisting knowing the deployment rotation. We have a strictly VOLUNTEER military. That means no one is forced to join.
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