Lew Rockwell's Analysis of the Election

[Publius]

Government enforced price floors have never and will never be a result of the free market.

[DosEquis]

Originally Posted by Publius

Government enforced price floors have never and will never be a result of the free market.

So if the floor generated by the free market was adequate do you think people would have organized? The free market screwed itself then, causing people to take these measures.

[nbiggershaft]

Originally Posted by Publius

Government enforced price floors have never and will never be a result of the free market.

Free market isn't god.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by nbiggershaft

Free market isn't god.

Government isn't god either.

[nbiggershaft]

Originally Posted by hsmith

Yes, that is why you have rising wages and competing offers for employment

the last time i looked for jobs i had a $10,000 difference in offers

golly! without the gov't i would be working for min wage! no one would think to compete for my labor!

Logical statements > you. Without the government you would be working for minimum wage?



On a serious note, obviously skilled workers are not a risk from no minimum wage. Without a minimum wage however most unskilled labor can hire certain groups for rediculous wages. Namely immigrants. Super low wages= poverty, poverty= more poverty babies, more disease, ghettos of people not speaking english, crime, ect. Hiring workers at decent wage insures a decent chance for these peoples children and circulates money for a better economy.

[nbiggershaft]

Originally Posted by Publius

Government isn't god either.

Of course not, but I don't shit myself when people question the government.

[nbiggershaft]

Originally Posted by AVengeance

Then how about starting your own business, getting employees, and paying them well.

was looking for some type of wank wank smilie

[lew]

Minimum wage laws seriously hurt the very people that they are supposed to be helping. If an employer has to give raises to it's minimum wage workers, one of three things will happen.

1. Prices of goods will raise as well, which then in turn affects everyone and will hurt companies because people won't buy as much from them anymore.

2. Companies will lay off some workers and tell the other workers that they have to make up for the slack.

3. Companies hire illegal workers and pay them "slave wages."


Minimum wage = bad. For every 1 person it "helps" it hurts 100 others.


The major reasons the Industrial Revolution were horrible to live under was not because of the free market. There was hardly any free market in those days. It was after Lincoln's deconstruction of our society. Government controlled most of those industries and we see the result of it. If the Industrial Revolution had really been a free market system, we wouldn't have seen the horrors that we did. Government is to blame for the bad side of the Revolution - not business.

[nbiggershaft]

Originally Posted by lew

1. Prices of goods will raise as well, which then in turn affects everyone and will hurt companies because people won't buy as much from them anymore.

2. Companies will lay off some workers and tell the other workers that they have to make up for the slack.

3. Companies hire illegal workers and pay them "slave wages."


Minimum wage = bad. For every 1 person it "helps" it hurts 100 others.

to number 1: I'd say, yes this is probably true, but unavoidable, and basically shifts with inflation.

Number 2: Ask the workers if they mind working a bit harder for more pay. And the ones who get laid off can find another minimum wage job pretty easy

Number 3: Better they have to do something illegal and face punishment for it than just being able to hire them for slave wages legally.

[hsmith]

Originally Posted by lew

Minimum wage laws seriously hurt the very people that they are supposed to be helping. If an employer has to give raises to it's minimum wage workers, one of three things will happen.

1. Prices of goods will raise as well, which then in turn affects everyone and will hurt companies because people won't buy as much from them anymore.

2. Companies will lay off some workers and tell the other workers that they have to make up for the slack.

3. Companies hire illegal workers and pay them "slave wages."


Minimum wage = bad. For every 1 person it "helps" it hurts 100 others.


The major reasons the Industrial Revolution were horrible to live under was not because of the free market. There was hardly any free market in those days. It was after Lincoln's deconstruction of our society. Government controlled most of those industries and we see the result of it. If the Industrial Revolution had really been a free market system, we wouldn't have seen the horrors that we did. Government is to blame for the bad side of the Revolution - not business.

wait, you mean the gov't not protecting peoples rights was to blame!

[motivez]

What's interesting to me is that despite talking up Libertarian ideas, ideals, and economic theories.. a true Libertarian country has never really existed, has it?

I really don't know that it ever will, since people don't want to do things for themselves, they want smarter people to do it for them.. and libertarianism is simply too much work.

On the other hand, the talking down of socialist ideas happens often, yet a level of socialism mixed with capitalism seems to work quite well for Europe, and many European countries have higher standards of living than we do.

So what's that about?

[lew]

Originally Posted by motivez

What's interesting to me is that despite talking up Libertarian ideas, ideals, and economic theories.. a true Libertarian country has never really existed, has it?

I really don't know that it ever will, since people don't want to do things for themselves, they want smarter people to do it for them.. and libertarianism is simply too much work.

On the other hand, the talking down of socialist ideas happens often, yet a level of socialism mixed with capitalism seems to work quite well for Europe, and many European countries have higher standards of living than we do.

So what's that about?

I think our country from it's founding to Lincoln was pretty libertarian.

[motivez]

Yeah, but modern times have changed things quite a bit..

I like the idea of personal responsibility a lot, I just don't know if it's realistic to expect people to want to do everything themselves instead of having a governmental agency do it for them anymore.