Question: Whats the difference between anarchy and pure libertarianism?

[lew]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

Yeah, volunteer fire departments exist either in very small towns, or they exist along side professional fire departments. You think a city like NY could have good firefighters that were all volunteers? They would have a shitload of them on weekends and not even close to enough during the week.

No, all volunteer fire departments across the country would be a disaster (pun intended).

Thanks for the proof.


There is proof that volunteer fire departments work. There isn't proof that they don't.

[hsmith]

Originally Posted by ballz2wallz

I don't believe police work, fire fighters, or any kind of security or military efforts should be private. Those truly are the responsbility of the government, I believe.

THen why are there private firefighters, private security firms, and mercenarys?

[lew]

Originally Posted by Publius

While true, I don't want to be in a situation where I would have to rely upon the charitability of my fellow citizens to protect my home.

You already do. It's called taxes.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by lew

Thanks for the proof.


There is proof that volunteer fire departments work. There isn't proof that they don't.

But he has a point. In larger cities they exist alongside professional fire departments. I think in the absence of a professional firefighting force, there would just be too much activity for a volunteer group to handle.

Now, a privately owned professional firefighting group, paid by a co-op of HOAs in a city... That could work just fine.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by lew

You already do. It's called taxes.

Taxes are taken by force though, they don't rely upon charitability.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Publius

Taxes are taken by force though, they don't rely upon charitability.

Of course. But what happens when all of your neighbors refuse to pay taxes?

[Publius]

Originally Posted by lew

Of course. But what happens when all of your neighbors refuse to pay taxes?

Unfortunately (for small govt lovers), that will never happen.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Publius

But he has a point. In larger cities they exist alongside professional fire departments. I think in the absence of a professional firefighting force, there would just be too much activity for a volunteer group to handle.

Now, a privately owned professional firefighting group, paid by a co-op of HOAs in a city... That could work just fine.

That's fine. I'm not advocating volunteer fire departments. I'm advocating private fire departments, volunteer or not is irrelevant.

[ballz2wallz]

Originally Posted by hsmith

THen why are there private firefighters, private security firms, and mercenarys?

Did I say there couldn't be any of those things?

I am a firm believer that the government's sole purpose is to provide us safety, from others and ourselves. That includes military, police, and firefighting services.

[Publius]

Originally Posted by lew

That's fine. I'm not advocating volunteer fire departments. I'm advocating private fire departments, volunteer or not is irrelevant.

[lew]

Originally Posted by ballz2wallz

Did I say there couldn't be any of those things?

I am a firm believer that the government's sole purpose is to provide us safety, from others and ourselves. That includes military, police, and firefighting services.

While that's not my ideal (being an anarchist), I would certainly be fine with a minarchist government.

[Stylerod]

Originally Posted by lew

Thanks for the proof.


There is proof that volunteer fire departments work. There isn't proof that they don't.

You have got to be fucking kidding me Face it Fred, pure Libertarianism is as much a pipe dream working as pure communism.

This was a 2 second google search

The truck was recently purchased for three thousand dollars ($3000.00). Two thousand dollars ($2000.00) has been spent trying to keep this truck in service to our area. Another two thousand ($2000.00) of our very limited operating budget was spent to repair the front end, replace water valves, repair the muffler and exhaust systems, and to deal with engine cooling problems. These problems have occurred while responding to support the Primrose VFD in a structure fire. We were unable to respond and Jarrett VFD had to carry out our commitment. This vehicle was out of service for over four months and cost over eight thousand ($8,000.00) in parts alone to get back in a fairly reliable condition, On another occasion our brush truck’s clutch went out, while in route to a brush fire in support of the Lytle VFD.

VolunteerFD.org, grant narratives for volunteer fire departments

There has yet to be one case where they couldn't put a fire out because of a lack of funds.

This has to be the dumbest statement on the board this week.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

You have got to be fucking kidding me Face it Fred, pure Libertarianism is as much a pipe dream working as pure communism.

This was a 2 second google search



VolunteerFD.org, grant narratives for volunteer fire departments



This has to be the dumbest statement on the board this week.

Why do you think they were underfunded? First being that people don't give enough to them right now because people don't think about it. Our whole system of government right now is about goverment taking care of things and fixing problems. In a completely different system, people would support these private departments since there would be no alternatives.

[Stylerod]

Originally Posted by lew

Why do you think they were underfunded? First being that people don't give enough to them right now because people don't think about it. Our whole system of government right now is about goverment taking care of things and fixing problems. In a completely different system, people would support these private departments since there would be no alternatives.

And if people had to, they still would try to get away with not giving their fair share. Hell, they are careful, they have never had a fire. Why is it their problem? It is, unfortunately, the way people are.

I'm going to quote this one more time just because of how ridiculous it was!

Originally Posted by Lew

There has yet to be one case where they couldn't put a fire out because of a lack of funds.

How fuckin stupid......

[nbiggershaft]

Originally Posted by hsmith

there are no private security firms? Are there no private fire companies? are there no toll roads? are there no disaster cleanup services? wells? private developments? government doesn't create electricity, private schools, health care is private

so, what is your point again?

Sounds like some type of banana republic to me. The problem is these services would only be available to the well off and organized if you made everything private. Then, like I said, angry, plauge-ridden people with pitchforks. There are places in the world where the police, the government, and just about all services are owned, we tend to frown on these places.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Stylerod

I'm going to quote this one more time just because of how ridiculous it was!

How fuckin stupid......

You have yet to put a link to show how stupid that comment was.

[Ardentfrost]

While I do think private firefighters, police, etc... COULD work, I don't promote that stuff.

And taxes are forcably taken from us to pay for those things, but they were paid for by the local gov'ts before 1913. So you can still be against forced taxes (as I am) and still be ok with public firefighters and shit.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

While I do think private firefighters, police, etc... COULD work, I don't promote that stuff.

And taxes are forcably taken from us to pay for those things, but they were paid for by the local gov'ts before 1913. So you can still be against forced taxes (as I am) and still be ok with public firefighters and shit.

[SICKGUY]

Originally Posted by lew

No, all of that stuff is fine. It will just be better if it was privatized and not government controlled.


And it'd actually be A LOT cheaper than it costs now, and they would be more effective.

i think it all sounds great if there was no such thing as greed. the iraq war is a perfect example of why privatizing government jobs is a bad idea.

the biggest fish in the market will set the rules, and ultimately work as a killer for the little guy. it would lead to the 2 or 3 biggest spenders running the show.