Individual Mandated Ruled Constitutional - Page 2

Salty Dog · 06-28-2012, 09:04 PM

I wasn't overly surprised Roberts sided with the government. He has gone on record on several occasions validating the importance of the federal government while also quickly explaining it needs to govern with restraint. His opinion today was essentially this theme and that's why he clarified the mandate is actually a tax because it is and always has been. Republicans would never have had the balls to admit it if it was their plan and Democrats used every word in the book to metaphorically distance themselves from their favorite 3 Letter word.

Edited to Add: Fox News is burning right now!!!

Fuck-In-A

Donkey® · 06-28-2012, 09:55 PM

Originally Posted by Salty Dog

I wasn't overly surprised Roberts sided with the government. He has gone on record on several occasions validating the importance of the federal government while also quickly explaining it needs to govern with restraint. His opinion today was essentially this theme and that's why he clarified the mandate is actually a tax because it is and always has been. Republicans would never have had the balls to admit it if it was their plan and Democrats used every word in the book to metaphorically distance themselves from their favorite 3 Letter word.

Edited to Add: Fox News is burning right now!!!

Fuck-In-A

Donkey® · 06-28-2012, 09:56 PM

Originally Posted by raps

The things you are hoping for are never going to happen. Ever since the inception of those programs they have grown constantly beyond any projections ever provided and it's not going to stop.

Stolz says it below. It HAS to stop...whether by choice or by the destruction of this country. I prefer to be hopeful that it's the former.

raps · 06-28-2012, 10:33 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Stolz says it below. It HAS to stop...whether by choice or by the destruction of this country. I prefer to be hopeful that it's the former.

I'd like to believe it will be the former too but with the current administration that is highly doubtful.

Donkey® · 06-28-2012, 11:10 PM

Originally Posted by raps

I'd like to believe it will be the former too but with the current administration that is highly doubtful.

Of course...but Mr. Romney will save us all...I mean...since he's done so much for us in the past 7 years.

DosEquis · 06-28-2012, 11:22 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

Of course...but Mr. Romney will save us all...I mean...since he's done so much for us in the past 7 years.

Yeah... he'd keep everythign in obama care... except the way to pay for it

northhunter · 06-28-2012, 11:45 PM

Something had to be done because what we had before simply wasn't working. Everyone must know someone who through no fault of their own either can't get or lost their health insurance. For those people at least here in Michigan procedures cost twice as much as people with insurance, explain that? It says right on my explanation of the bill I recently got from the hospital " discount because patient has insurance" and every single itemitized expense is cut in half!
This may not be perfect but like ( I think it was Donkey) has been saying start here and fix what needs to be fixed.
Is it perfect? Hell no few things are but there was nothing for millions of americans before this act. I say it's a win for everyone in ways we haven't even realized yet and if we see expenses come down because the hospitals don't have to pass along the cost of treating the uninsured like is supposed to happen I think many who are now against it will come around.
Thats my two cents anyway, I know not everyone is happy how it went today.

CayLargo · 06-29-2012, 01:17 AM

Originally Posted by raps

Not a conspiracy, just the influence of political bullshit. Roosevelt did something similar with threats to the scotus if they didn't start ruling in his favor on things.

Hmm, so you are saying Bush most likely was "selected" by the Supremes because he made threats?

stolz25 · 06-29-2012, 01:29 AM

Originally Posted by raps

I'd like to believe it will be the former too but with the current administration that is highly doubtful.

You guys crack me up. No matter how long both parties continually screw you over you insist on this bipartisan bickering.

raps · 06-29-2012, 06:27 AM

Originally Posted by northhunter

Something had to be done because what we had before simply wasn't working. Everyone must know someone who through no fault of their own either can't get or lost their health insurance. For those people at least here in Michigan procedures cost twice as much as people with insurance, explain that? It says right on my explanation of the bill I recently got from the hospital " discount because patient has insurance" and every single itemitized expense is cut in half!
This may not be perfect but like ( I think it was Donkey) has been saying start here and fix what needs to be fixed.
Is it perfect? Hell no few things are but there was nothing for millions of americans before this act. I say it's a win for everyone in ways we haven't even realized yet and if we see expenses come down because the hospitals don't have to pass along the cost of treating the uninsured like is supposed to happen I think many who are now against it will come around.
Thats my two cents anyway, I know not everyone is happy how it went today.

Companies are already sending out notices to employees that insurance rates are going to rise because of this bill in response to the company receiving notices from the insurance companies. The minimum coverage changes are going to increase costs. Now, it is providing subsidies for those who have limited income but how much is that really going to help the middle class most of which are above the cutoff and already struggling in this shithole of an economy? The bill will also reduce reimbursements to doctors which makes the whole idea of becoming a doctor less attractive and they will more than likely have to offset that reduction somewhere else like the insurance companies who in turn will raise rates to keep up with the additional cost.

DosEquis · 06-29-2012, 09:10 AM

Originally Posted by stolz25

You guys crack me up. No matter how long both parties continually screw you over you insist on this bipartisan bickering.

democrats use lube. the repubs are the ones dry humping us in the airport restroom telling me the trickle down is the best part.

stolz25 · 06-29-2012, 10:07 AM

Originally Posted by DosEquis

democrats use lube. the repubs are the ones dry humping us in the airport restroom telling me the trickle down is the best part.

Whatever you need to tell yourself.

Donkey® · 06-29-2012, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by raps

Companies are already sending out notices to employees that insurance rates are going to rise because of this bill in response to the company receiving notices from the insurance companies. The minimum coverage changes are going to increase costs. Now, it is providing subsidies for those who have limited income but how much is that really going to help the middle class most of which are above the cutoff and already struggling in this shithole of an economy? The bill will also reduce reimbursements to doctors which makes the whole idea of becoming a doctor less attractive and they will more than likely have to offset that reduction somewhere else like the insurance companies who in turn will raise rates to keep up with the additional cost.

There is no shortage of doctors. There are more than enough people in school around the world that want to come to America to be a dr. Also, companies were already giving us notices that our rates were climbing...year after year after year...except now there's a limit to how much they can go up.

northhunter · 06-29-2012, 04:42 PM

Originally Posted by raps

Companies are already sending out notices to employees that insurance rates are going to rise because of this bill in response to the company receiving notices from the insurance companies. The minimum coverage changes are going to increase costs. Now, it is providing subsidies for those who have limited income but how much is that really going to help the middle class most of which are above the cutoff and already struggling in this shithole of an economy? The bill will also reduce reimbursements to doctors which makes the whole idea of becoming a doctor less attractive and they will more than likely have to offset that reduction somewhere else like the insurance companies who in turn will raise rates to keep up with the additional cost.

Is it perfect? Hell no few things are but there was nothing for millions of americans before this act.

Like I said before this was put in place for many millions there was nothing, not a little bit or less than was needed there was nothing!
And with the sudden jump in the number of insurance customers, insurance companies should be carefull with any increases. They already have to give out millions in rebates for overdoing wages and bonuses. I'd love to see them have to do it again for unecessary rate increases.

illavbill · 06-29-2012, 05:51 PM

Originally Posted by northhunter

Is it perfect? Hell no few things are but there was nothing for millions of americans before this act.

Like I said before this was put in place for many millions there was nothing, not a little bit or less than was needed there was nothing!
And with the sudden jump in the number of insurance customers, insurance companies should be carefull with any increases. They already have to give out millions in rebates for overdoing wages and bonuses. I'd love to see them have to do it again for unecessary rate increases.

My rates have been increasing way way too much over the last 10 years that I've had insurance through my employer who is a Hospital system. I can't believe how much my premiums have raised. ANYTHING to reform the system was necessary. My hospital writes off many MILLIONS a year in charity care for people who can't pay or don't pay, but we still treat them because it is the right thing to do. I can't believe we agree

The Great Catpiss · 06-29-2012, 07:43 PM

Originally Posted by illavbill

My rates have been increasing way way too much over the last 10 years that I've had insurance through my employer who is a Hospital system. I can't believe how much my premiums have raised. ANYTHING to reform the system was necessary. My hospital writes off many MILLIONS a year in charity care for people who can't pay or don't pay, but we still treat them because it is the right thing to do. I can't believe we agree

And someone will still have to pay for their care. Either they will, or we will. The end result is the same. Prices get averaged in.

Perhaps costs will stabilize if insurance is restricted. As long as the insurance companies are willing to pay outrageous prices, we will continue to see price increases.

stolz25 · 06-29-2012, 11:17 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

There is no shortage of doctors.

Huh? If this is the case there is a basic law of economics breaking down somewhere. If we had a surplus of doctors healthcare costs wouldn't be skyrocketing.

illavbill · 06-30-2012, 03:08 AM

Originally Posted by stolz25

Huh? If this is the case there is a basic law of economics breaking down somewhere. If we had a surplus of doctors healthcare costs wouldn't be skyrocketing.

there is a WHOLE FREAKING LOT more to healthcare costs than doctors way way way more.

David · 06-30-2012, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by stolz25

Huh? If this is the case there is a basic law of economics breaking down somewhere. If we had a surplus of doctors healthcare costs wouldn't be skyrocketing.

Healthcare costs are high due to defensive medicine and fraud. A shortage of doctors there is not (not with the kind of money they make). Nurses are another matter.

stolz25 · 06-30-2012, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by illavbill

there is a WHOLE FREAKING LOT more to healthcare costs than doctors way way way more.

Yes, thank you for this amazing bit of information.

Nevertheless, if there were a bunch of doctors sitting around without patients the cost of going o the doctor would be dropping. Instead you have to make sure to get an appointment weeks ahead of time and many doctors around here aren't even accepting new patients.