92 yr old woman resists police state, pays with her life

AVengeance · 11-22-2006, 03:14 PM

Woman, 92, dies in shootout with police - CNN.com

ATLANTA, Georgia (AP) -- A 92-year-old woman was shot to death Tuesday after she fired at three narcotics officers trying to serve a warrant at her house, officials said.
Neighbors and relatives said it must have been a case of mistaken identity. Police said they had the right address.
Police said the woman, identified as Kathryn Johnson, was the only person at that address at the time, and had lived there for about 17 years.
As the plainclothes Atlanta police officers approached the house about 7 p.m., a woman inside started shooting, striking each of them, said Officer Joe Cobb, a police spokesman.
Assistant Chief Alan Dreher said the officers had a legal warrant and "knocked and announced" before they forced open the door. He said they were justified in returning fire when they were fired upon.
One was hit in the arm, another in a thigh and the third in a shoulder. The officers were taken to a hospital for treatment, and all three were conscious and alert, police said.
Sarah Dozier, identified as a niece of the woman, told WAGA-TV that there were never any drugs at the house.
"My aunt was in good health. I'm sure she panicked when they kicked that door down," Dozier said. "There was no reason they had to go in there and shoot her down like a dog."

Look for the media to sanitize this story a bit, as you can currently see that there are impossible elements right now that need to be "ironed out". Basically, some plain-clothes narcs bang on the door to a little old lady's house. Probably fearing being robbed, she pulls a gun. Plain-clothes officers bust in, and she nails THREE of them (none with life-threatening injuries), before being gunned down like a dog.

Damn, I hope I'm that good a shot at 92!

And whoever was in charge of the drug raid needs to die in a fire.

Publius · 11-22-2006, 03:18 PM

So, did they find any narcotics in the house after they killed her?

Phantom · 11-22-2006, 03:21 PM

seems like they killed the only witness so nobody will every know what really happened

Police should absolutely be required to be in uniform when serving warrants though - especially in high crime areas. If I lived in a high crime area and a few guys dressed in street clothes knocked at my door with a "warrant," I wouldn't just open the door and let them in

Publius · 11-22-2006, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by Phantom

seems like they killed the only witness so nobody will every know what really happened

Police should absolutely be required to be in uniform when serving warrants though - especially in high crime areas. If I lived in a high crime area and a few guys dressed in street clothes knocked at my door with a "warrant," I wouldn't just open the door and let them in

Why the fuck were they serving a warrant in street clothes?

AVengeance · 11-22-2006, 03:32 PM

Originally Posted by Publius

Why the fuck were they serving a warrant in street clothes?

Narc jobs are often done that way. Makes no sense, except to make a bigger mess of an already bad situation.

Originally Posted by Publius

So, did they find any narcotics in the house after they killed her?

Nothing that the news is reporting so far. It's looking like maybe a typo on the search warrant?

The fact that they were plainclothes may be the worst part of it. I somehow doubt the cops just knocked on the door, and she started shooting them. Actually, the way the article reads, you'd think she started shooting BEFORE they even knocked. Either way, it doesn't look like she had the bad habit of filling anyone that came to her door full of lead, so the cops' story just doesn't add up.

Diesel66 · 11-22-2006, 05:09 PM

Originally Posted by AVengeance

Actually, the way the article reads, you'd think she started shooting BEFORE they even knocked.

getting different info
MyFox Atlanta | Elderly Woman Shot, Killed By Police Officers

Officer says they knocked, entered then shot at.

6SpeedTA95 · 11-22-2006, 05:13 PM

The article doesn't say if the officers were inside the house, that makes a big fucking difference.

RMNIXON · 11-22-2006, 06:30 PM

My question would be what justified the warrant? Was there a mistake in the address or did someone use this place with or without her knowledge?

As for the shooting it sounds like a person of that age might not have been alert or could clearly hear when the police demanded to enter. They move very fast because drug dealers will hide and/or destroy a stash in a manner of seconds. I think she was starlted and fired and they had no choice but to return fire. Very sad all around!

SpicyMcVoodoo · 11-22-2006, 08:36 PM

How on earth could anyone try to twist this to make the police look bad?

Three police approach a woman's house, announce that they're police, and in response the woman shoots 3 of them. What do you expect the police to do? Apologize for disturbing her and leave? Of course they're going to shoot her. The fact that she's a 94 year old woman is completely irrelevant.

If you're going to give a senile, trigger happy woman a gun, you have to accept the consequences if she shoots at the wrong people.

@ people trying to make this about a "police state." There are better examples than this to stake your argument on.

Diesel66 · 11-22-2006, 08:38 PM

Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo

How on earth could anyone try to twist this to make the police look bad?

Three police approach a woman's house, announce that they're police, and in response the woman shoots 3 of them.

middle of the night someone yells police then breaks down your door, why shouldnt she defend herself ? Because crooks couldnt possible yell police before breaking in

new info

Even if the warrant was perfectly justified, breaking into a home is very dangerous. She could be a criminal (or allowing a criminal to operate there) and justified in fearing a home invasion.

No knock warrants are retarded and going to cost a lot of civilians and police their lifes.

NEWS - US NATIONAL - Comcast.net

The agents got a search warrant after buying drugs Tuesday afternoon from a man in Kathryn Johnston's home, Assistant Police Chief Alan Dreher said.

Woman, 92, dies in shootout with police | Chron.com - Houston Chronicle

Investigators also said they found drugs in the home after Johnston was killed. Officer Joe Cobb, a police spokesman, said the type of drug involved would not be disclosed until it was verified by the crime lab.

SpicyMcVoodoo · 11-22-2006, 08:39 PM

Originally Posted by 6SpeedTA95

The article doesn't say if the officers were inside the house, that makes a big fucking difference.

If they announced that they were police, I don't see what difference it makes. You can't shoot at the police when they announce who they are and enter your home.

Of course, if you're 92 years old, you might not hear or see very well that they are police, in which case the problem here is a 92 year old woman possessing a gun.

AVengeance · 11-22-2006, 08:45 PM

Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo

If they announced that they were police, I don't see what difference it makes. You can't shoot at the police when they announce who they are and enter your home.

Of course, if you're 92 years old, you might not hear or see very well that they are police, in which case the problem here is a 92 year old woman possessing a gun.

I know this has already been said, but do you realize that a criminal could yell "POLICE!!!" just as easily as a real cop? Anyone can "announce" they're the police. Her home was invaded, and she defended her home. More people need to shoot cops until they stop doing this.

Kytro · 11-22-2006, 09:11 PM

Originally Posted by AVengeance

I know this has already been said, but do you realize that a criminal could yell "POLICE!!!" just as easily as a real cop? Anyone can "announce" they're the police. Her home was invaded, and she defended her home. More people need to shoot cops until they stop doing this.

While I agree that they should not be busting down doors in plain clothes if more people shot the police I doubt it would stop them

thomez · 11-22-2006, 09:34 PM

RIP old lady defending her home.

SpicyMcVoodoo · 11-22-2006, 10:29 PM

Originally Posted by AVengeance

I know this has already been said, but do you realize that a criminal could yell "POLICE!!!" just as easily as a real cop? Anyone can "announce" they're the police. Her home was invaded, and she defended her home. More people need to shoot cops until they stop doing this.

Yeah, and people have also posed as policemen to kidnap and rape women. Does that mean when the police try to pull a woman over she's justified in shooting the cop that comes to her window?

Your thinking has a very slippery slope. The idea that it could be a criminal posing as a cop, so you're justified in treating the cop as a criminal, would lead to anarchy. As a society, you have to assume that people who claim they're cops are really cops. Otherwise we'd have police shootouts every 2 seconds on every corner in America.

thomez · 11-22-2006, 10:44 PM

Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo

Yeah, and people have also posed as policemen to kidnap and rape women. Does that mean when the police try to pull a woman over she's justified in shooting the cop that comes to her window?

Your thinking has a very slippery slope. The idea that it could be a criminal posing as a cop, so you're justified in treating the cop as a criminal, would lead to anarchy. As a society, you have to assume that people who claim they're cops are really cops. Otherwise we'd have police shootouts every 2 seconds on every corner in America.

if some group of guys, in plainclothes, breaks in my door with weapons drawn, I'm probably not going to take the time to asess if they "look like a cop" or not

Diamond Cross · 11-22-2006, 10:53 PM

Why is it these discussion always tend to boil dow to between those who love the police and seem to believe the police can do no wrong, and between those who hate the police whop can do no right?

No wonder police are so screwed sometimes.

SpicyMcVoodoo · 11-23-2006, 01:22 AM

Originally Posted by Diamond Cross

Why is it these discussion always tend to boil dow to between those who love the police and seem to believe the police can do no wrong, and between those who hate the police whop can do no right?

No wonder police are so screwed sometimes.

More like those who live in reality vs. those who live in libertarian wonder land. I can't believe you guys are actually arguing the police are at fault for announcing they are police, serving a valid warrant, and then shooting a woman who shot three of them first.

Whoops, I forgot a category: Those who think the police are always wrong when the victim has a sympathetic quality, like being very young, very old, etc., despite giving the police no choice.

SpicyMcVoodoo · 11-23-2006, 01:26 AM

Originally Posted by thomez

if some group of guys, in plainclothes, breaks in my door with weapons drawn, I'm probably not going to take the time to asess if they "look like a cop" or not

You don't have to assess if they look like cops when they're yelling that they're the police at the top of their lungs.

thomez · 11-23-2006, 01:43 AM

Originally Posted by SpicyMcVoodoo

You don't have to assess if