130 American Interventions - Page 2

kinggovernor · 12-08-2006, 08:06 AM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

It puts citizens of our country in harm's way for no reason.

that is an assumption

lew · 12-08-2006, 09:50 AM

Originally Posted by Diamond Cross

That's not what I asked.

Where in the Constitution does it say that?

The constitution gives the federal government limited, enumerated powers. Interventionism isn't one of the listed powers, therefore it's unconstitutional.

DosEquis · 12-08-2006, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by JaJae

I fail to see how it's a bad thing.

IRAN/ 1953/ Command operation/ CIA overthrows democracy, installs
Shah.

I give you the beginning of the hatred for our country in the middle east.

Donkey® · 12-08-2006, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by kinggovernor

that is an assumption

How is that an assumption? We have American Citizens in the military no? They get "intervened" into hotzones and other dangerous scenarios. No? 404-assumptionnotfound.

MoTaVa · 12-08-2006, 12:52 PM

Isolation. Yea, thats what I want.

(sarc)

hsmith · 12-08-2006, 12:53 PM

Originally Posted by MoTaVa

Isolation. Yea, thats what I want. (sarc)

intervention has worked so well for us

lew · 12-08-2006, 01:26 PM

Originally Posted by MoTaVa

Isolation. Yea, thats what I want. (sarc)

isolationism > interventionism

Diamond Cross · 12-08-2006, 02:00 PM

Originally Posted by lew

The constitution gives the federal government limited, enumerated powers. Interventionism isn't one of the listed powers, therefore it's unconstitutional.

That's NOT the question I asked.

Where exactly does it say that "THOU SHALT NOT INTERVENE" in the constitution?

This is the third time I've asked this question and nobody's answered it. I'm beginning to think that it can't be found, and since it can't be found there's nothing to prevent America from intervention. Even if it isn't listed, does not neccessarily mean it's unconstitutional but may be something inferred.

For example, the right to privacy is not specifically listed in the Constitution, so therefore we can assume that it is unconcstitutional if anything not listed in the constitution is unconstitutional.

lew · 12-08-2006, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by Diamond Cross

That's NOT the question I asked.

Where exactly does it say that "THOU SHALT NOT INTERVENE" in the constitution?

This is the third time I've asked this question and nobody's answered it. I'm beginning to think that it can't be found, and since it can't be found there's nothing to prevent America from intervention. Even if it isn't listed, does not neccessarily mean it's unconstitutional but may be something inferred.

For example, the right to privacy is not specifically listed in the Constitution, so therefore we can assume that it is unconcstitutional if anything not listed in the constitution is unconstitutional.

I answered your question.

The Constitution gives the government EXACT, detailed powers. If a certain power isn't listed, it's unconstitutional and illegal for the government to engage into it. This is why something like 90% of what the government does today is unconstitutional.

kinggovernor · 12-08-2006, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

How is that an assumption? We have American Citizens in the military no? They get "intervened" into hotzones and other dangerous scenarios. No? 404-assumptionnotfound.

and what is so bad about that?

DosEquis · 12-08-2006, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by kinggovernor

and what is so bad about that?

The problem develops when people volunteer or get drafted to defend their country, but the conflict they go fight in has nothing to do with defending this country. Then they are killed, a parent loses a child, a child loses a parent, and for what? For who? They just died for nothing and were paid the same as the guy putting plywood in home depots warehouse.

The abuse of our military forces, and the citizens which are apart of it, is completely disgusting.

hsmith · 12-08-2006, 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by Diamond Cross

That's NOT the question I asked.

Where exactly does it say that "THOU SHALT NOT INTERVENE" in the constitution?

This is the third time I've asked this question and nobody's answered it. I'm beginning to think that it can't be found, and since it can't be found there's nothing to prevent America from intervention. Even if it isn't listed, does not neccessarily mean it's unconstitutional but may be something inferred.

For example, the right to privacy is not specifically listed in the Constitution, so therefore we can assume that it is unconcstitutional if anything not listed in the constitution is unconstitutional.

uh, that is how the constitution works

Diamond Cross · 12-08-2006, 06:27 PM

So if something is not listed in the Constitution, then it is completely unconstitutional?

kinggovernor · 12-08-2006, 06:49 PM

Originally Posted by DosEquis

The problem develops when people volunteer or get drafted to defend their country, but the conflict they go fight in has nothing to do with defending this country. Then they are killed, a parent loses a child, a child loses a parent, and for what? For who? They just died for nothing and were paid the same as the guy putting plywood in home depots warehouse.

The abuse of our military forces, and the citizens which are apart of it, is completely disgusting.

this depends on what your definition of defending the country means.

Diesel66 · 12-08-2006, 07:09 PM

Originally Posted by lew

I answered your question.

The Constitution gives the government EXACT, detailed powers. If a certain power isn't listed, it's unconstitutional and illegal for the government to engage into it. This is why something like 90% of what the government does today is unconstitutional.

forgeting about that clause "To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof. "

lew · 12-08-2006, 07:20 PM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

forgeting about that clause "To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution the foregoing powers, and all other powers vested by this Constitution in the government of the United States, or in any department or officer thereof. "

Strict constructionists such as myself see that clause as only being applicable to creating laws that directly facilitate the expressed powers. Interventionism and a million other things the government does is not applicable to those enumerated powers.

Diesel66 · 12-08-2006, 07:26 PM

Originally Posted by lew

Strict constructionists such as myself see that clause as only being applicable to creating laws that directly facilitate the expressed powers. Interventionism and a million other things the government does is not applicable to those enumerated powers.

Different views on if a war directly facilitates them or not though.

Take WWII, we had no real reason to go into Europe. But try and find anyone that will defend an isolationist argument against that war.

Donkey® · 12-08-2006, 07:31 PM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

Different views on if a war directly facilitates them or not though.

Take WWII, we had no real reason to go into Europe. But try and find anyone that will defend an isolationist argument against that war.

We were being attacked left and right by the Germans and Japanese even before we officially joined the war.

Diesel66 · 12-08-2006, 07:48 PM

Originally Posted by Donkey®

We were being attacked left and right by the Germans and Japanese even before we officially joined the war.

because we werent neutral. The Germans only attacked our ships that were supplying UK/Russia. And we started fighting Japan before Pearl Harbor.

Donkey® · 12-08-2006, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by Diesel66

because we werent neutral. The Germans only attacked our ships that were supplying UK/Russia. And we started fighting Japan before Pearl Harbor.

Not EVERY ship they attacked had supplies. They were attacking everything.