Originally Posted by Ardentfrost I'm being double teamed lol People in NYC and LA shouldn't be the only people that matter. The EC helps that. I think democrats and the uneducated are the only ones that hate the EC... because democrats know that city people are also democrats, and they ...
08-04-2006, 02:26 AM
| #41 | ||||
| Banned - Self Imposed  Progressive Philadelphia, PA 
| Originally Posted by Ardentfrost Try being 10x teamed and that was my life on OT main forum in 2002
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08-04-2006, 02:29 AM
| #42 | ||||
| For those about to rock...  libertarian Atlanta, GA
| Originally Posted by Scrumtralecent It's not a lower voice, it's just that NY issues should have a similar weight to Montana issues. It's not about the number of people, but the total needs.
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08-04-2006, 02:29 AM
| #43 | ||||
| For those about to rock... libertarian Atlanta, GA
| I really gotta go to bed, for real...  | ||||
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08-04-2006, 02:32 AM
| #44 | ||||
| helluo librorum The Lab Moderator  Humanist Chicago Suburbs
| Originally Posted by Ardentfrost One farmer in the middle of BFI has more needs for representation than a city block of Chicago?
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08-04-2006, 02:32 AM
| #45 | ||||
| helluo librorum The Lab Moderator Humanist Chicago Suburbs
| Originally Posted by Ardentfrost Don't you go to bed.
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08-04-2006, 02:33 AM
| #46 | ||||
| Banned - Self Imposed Progressive Philadelphia, PA
| Originally Posted by Scrumtralecent He admits defeat and abandons libertarianism! lew will be so disappointed
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08-04-2006, 02:34 AM
| #47 | ||||
| helluo librorum The Lab Moderator Humanist Chicago Suburbs
| Originally Posted by Thorgrim
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08-04-2006, 08:50 AM
| #48 | ||||
| For those about to rock... libertarian Atlanta, GA
| lol, sorry, I had to get up early this morning (3 hours earlier than I normally get up) | ||||
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08-04-2006, 08:57 AM
| #49 | ||||
| Banned - Self Imposed Progressive Philadelphia, PA
| i had to get up early too, sucks what the hell is on TV at 8am? | ||||
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08-04-2006, 08:57 AM
| #50 | ||||
| For those about to rock... libertarian Atlanta, GA
| The thing is, it doesn't matter how many people from NYC vote, they're only allowed to hold so much weight. I mean, if you're pissed at the NUMBER of EVs each state gets, that's based on total population of the state. And eventhough in Montana, if only one person in the entire state votes, he gets all the EV's, that's not a bad thing, he's just representing the interests of the entire state (or, he's understood to since no one else cared enough to vote). The EC allows everyone to get represented in a vote, even those who do not vote. The vote could be seen as "what does XX state see as the MOST important issues and which candidate represents those issues the best." People inside XX state may disagree, but if 50%+1 of the people think it should be done a certain way, then that will be representative of XX state. Getting rid of the EC would simply undermine states even more. I mean, they're pretty undermined as it is... we've been taking a ride down a slippery slope since the civil war. I would just hate to see the EC go when it's one of the last things that represents seeing a state as it's own entity. | ||||
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08-04-2006, 08:58 AM
| #51 | ||||
| For those about to rock... libertarian Atlanta, GA
| Originally Posted by Thorgrim Dunno, watching weather channel before I head in to work. I think I'm going to have to get a coffee when I get there. I am NOT a morning person
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08-04-2006, 09:52 AM
| #52 | ||||
| helluo librorum The Lab Moderator Humanist Chicago Suburbs
| Originally Posted by Ardentfrost Your EC rep votes for who they want, not who won the district.
Originally Posted by Ardentfrost I would much rather see the states go the wayside than the individual citizens, which is what happens now.
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08-04-2006, 10:04 AM
| #53 | ||||
| For those about to rock... libertarian Atlanta, GA
| Originally Posted by Scrumtralecent EC reps CAN vote for whomever they want, but in the history of the EC a rep hasn't voted for who they're supposed to, what, twice? Something like that. They chose a member of the party.
Individuals should have little to do with the federal government and vice versa. The fed is too large to deal with my or your needs. We should be dealing directly with smaller governments and those governments should have the power to change for the needs of their citizens. States haven't been undermined to prevent that yet, look at legislation Mass has passed compared to South Dakota... but there is a LOT of policy pushing to and from the federal government. That's a recipe for going from a constitutional republic to a constitutional monarchy. | ||||
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08-04-2006, 10:50 AM
| #54 | ||||
| Anti-War, Anti-State, Pro-Free Market  Capitalist
| Originally Posted by Scrumtralecent
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08-04-2006, 10:52 AM
| #55 | ||||
| Anti-War, Anti-State, Pro-Free Market Capitalist
| Originally Posted by Thorgrim
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08-04-2006, 10:53 AM
| #56 | ||||
| Junkie  Conservative Party
| Originally Posted by Thorgrim Good thing we are not a democracy then. Otherwise only a couple big cities would be picking the President. Come to CA if you want to see direct voting in action. Bay Area and LA control the whole state, and the people love to raise other's taxes to pay for stuff everyone uses.
~15-20% of the state uses tobacco reguarly. And guess how the vote was to raise the tobacco tax some outragous amount ? 75-25%. Originally Posted by Thorgrim Yet the wealthiest Americans are Democrats while the middle class is Republican ?
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08-04-2006, 10:56 AM
| #57 | ||||
| Banned - Self Imposed Progressive Philadelphia, PA
| Originally Posted by Diesel66 im going to need a link on the latter point
how exactly would you fix california's obviously flawed and outrageous system...maybe giving all the negros in LA half a vote while all the whites in Orange County get 2 votes? | ||||
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08-04-2006, 11:01 AM
| #58 | ||||
| Anti-War, Anti-State, Pro-Free Market Capitalist
| Originally Posted by Thorgrim
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08-04-2006, 11:09 AM
| #59 | ||||
| Junkie Conservative Party
| Originally Posted by Thorgrim The real poor (<15k) vote Dem 2 out of 3
working class/lower middle class (<75k) is slightly Republican but Dems are losing some 20 points from whites in this group upper class that earn a living (doctors, lawyers) and business owners are Republican 2 out of 3 Wealthy are Democrat. here is some info http://people-press.org/commentary/pdf/114.pdf The real wealthy just dont care about tax cuts, look at Warran buffet telling the govt to raise his taxes.
Both areas are highly populated. Try giving some power to the North, the Siera cities, the central valley, napa area, desert area. | ||||
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08-04-2006, 11:12 AM
| #60 | ||||
| Banned - Self Imposed Progressive Philadelphia, PA
| Originally Posted by Diesel66 yeah your link basically refuted what you said...the richest quintile voted GOP by a significant margin
and cali... Ok, give 2 votes to whites in Northeastern Cali, and half a vote to the colored folk in LA interesting proposal, are you gathering signatures? | ||||
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