Study: Nicotine increasing in cigarettes

[Phantom]

Originally Posted by lew

What would that solve?

It would give people a chance to better know what they are getting into. IMO it's kinda sneaky for the cig companies to increase the addictive ingridient in their product without telling anyone.

I doubt this will make a difference in anyone's decisions, but at least there will be a little more fair notice.

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

I didn't say quitting was easy. My sister and brother-in-law have tried to quit several times, but keep starting again. But they chose to start it up so they have to deal with it. It is not the government's job to come in and be a fucking mother to all of us and keep those big bad corporations away from us.

Addicted or not, it is YOUR choice that keeps going back to buy more. It's one thing if they get you addicted and then come to your house daily to force you to smoke; it's another when you choose to continually support them by buying more of their products.

Again, you don't understand what addiction is, there's no way I can explain it to you. Here's how you can get a rough idea. Have a friend follow you all week long. Every hour or so, have him say, "let's get something to eat." Have it so he says it every 30 seconds or so, right behind you. Have him say it over and over until you say ok and do it.


I'm sure you'll be fine with it for a few hours. maybe even a day or two. After that you'll learn a little bit what it's like.

And your excuse "oh it's a kid's choice to start smoking, they should suffer" is just horrible. You might change your mind when you have kids, at least I hope you do.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

Again, you don't understand what addiction is, there's no way I can explain it to you. Here's how you can get a rough idea. Have a friend follow you all week long. Every hour or so, have him say, "let's get something to eat." Have it so he says it every 30 seconds or so, right behind you. Have him say it over and over until you say ok and do it.


I'm sure you'll be fine with it for a few hours. maybe even a day or two. After that you'll learn a little bit what it's like.

And your excuse "oh it's a kid's choice to start smoking, they should suffer" is just horrible. You might change your mind when you have kids, at least I hope you do.

I don't understand what addiction is? Right. Because the only addiction out there is tobacco.

Alcohol, food, porn, weed, percocet, other legal and illegal drugs, and countless other things couldn't possibly be addictions that have affected me.

The difference between you and me is that I take responsibility for my addictions and flaws. I blame me for failing. I don't try to blame some corporation or anyone else.

[Ardentfrost]

Originally Posted by lew

I don't understand what addiction is? Right. Because the only addiction out there is tobacco.

Alcohol, food, porn, weed, percocet, other legal and illegal drugs, and countless other things couldn't possibly be addictions that have affected me.

The difference between you and me is that I take responsibility for my addictions and flaws. I blame me for failing. I don't try to blame some corporation or anyone else.

This smilie isn't near big enough:

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

I don't understand what addiction is? Right. Because the only addiction out there is tobacco.

Alcohol, food, porn, weed, percocet, other legal and illegal drugs, and countless other things couldn't possibly be addictions that have affected me.

The difference between you and me is that I take responsibility for my addictions and flaws. I blame me for failing. I don't try to blame some corporation or anyone else.

WHAT?

porn? not addictive, at least not physically. Get a girlfriend

weed is not addictive, I used to smoke it daily, stopped long ago and never had an urge.


When have I ever said I'm not responsible for my addiction? However I'm not going to tell a kid to "deal with it," nor will I take such an adversarial stance against people that want to quit.


the ONLY thing I am blaming on the tobacco companies is INCREASING the addictive agent in cigarettes.


so what are you addicted to? alcohol? meth? do tell.

[Ardentfrost]

Personal experience does not make you an expert on the subject. That's the fallacy of... something... appeal to authority or something.

Anyway, if you care about people's addictions, then that's fine, go work at a methadone clinic or something. But these are political forums, as such conversations will be centered around the political consequences (or actions) of certain stimuli. Phantom suggested putting the amount of nicotine on the container, and that's a logical conclusion... or there could be a place to see the nicotine content of certain brands of cigarettes.

Lew and others (including myself) promote minimal government involvement. If you think we should feel bad about people being addicted to cigarettes, that's personal preference. I know I don't and I'm pretty sure Lew doesn't. But that's pretty irrelevant. How I personally feel about addiction matters little to how the government should approach the issue (or even if they should at all)

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

WHAT?

porn? not addictive, at least not physically. Get a girlfriend

weed is not addictive, I used to smoke it daily, stopped long ago and never had an urge.


When have I ever said I'm not responsible for my addiction? However I'm not going to tell a kid to "deal with it," nor will I take such an adversarial stance against people that want to quit.


the ONLY thing I am blaming on the tobacco companies is INCREASING the addictive agent in cigarettes.


so what are you addicted to? alcohol? meth? do tell.

You're going to argue that porn isn't addictive?

That's why corporations spend untold amounts of money to prevent access to porn so that their employees can actually work. Porn is pure addiction. Whether or not porn addiction is a good, bad, or neither thing can be debated, but it is an addiction.

Oh, and I'm married.

Weed can be addictive. For a lot of people, it isn't. But for some it is.


Again, if you want to quit, you can. Don't blame it on the companies for increasing their nicotine. There are so many methods out there to help stop smoking that anyone can do it. Whether that person decides to choose to stay on that plan though, is another thing entirely. The point is, it's YOUR choice to stop or keep smoking. It's not easy. It may very well be the hardest thing you ever do in your life. But you have to choose to do that. And if you fall on your face and fail, then you get right back up determined to not let your fall stop you from reaching your destination. What you don't do though, is when you fall start bitching about the companies and placing the blame on them. These companies are doing exactly what their customers want - you buy a cigarette for nicotine, they're giving you more.

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by Ardentfrost

Personal experience does not make you an expert on the subject. That's the fallacy of... something... appeal to authority or something.

Anyway, if you care about people's addictions, then that's fine, go work at a methadone clinic or something. But these are political forums, as such conversations will be centered around the political consequences (or actions) of certain stimuli. Phantom suggested putting the amount of nicotine on the container, and that's a logical conclusion... or there could be a place to see the nicotine content of certain brands of cigarettes.

Lew and others (including myself) promote minimal government involvement. If you think we should feel bad about people being addicted to cigarettes, that's personal preference. I know I don't and I'm pretty sure Lew doesn't. But that's pretty irrelevant. How I personally feel about addiction matters little to how the government should approach the issue (or even if they should at all)

I never claimed that this was a government issue, only that this matter may pertain to the settlement by the tobacco companies, which is a pre-existing issue.

I posted this article not to discuss addiction, that was brought up by phantom, lew, and 6speed. The lawsuit also wasn't because of the fact that cigs are addictive, it was because of deceptive tactics used by the companies.

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

You're going to argue that porn isn't addictive?

That's why corporations spend untold amounts of money to prevent access to porn so that their employees can actually work. Porn is pure addiction. Whether or not porn addiction is a good, bad, or neither thing can be debated, but it is an addiction.

Oh, and I'm married.

porn is not physically addictive. There is no chemical that's introduced BY porn, only in response to porn.

Weed can be addictive. For a lot of people, it isn't. But for some it is.

this is a mental issue, not a physical one.

Again, if you want to quit, you can. Don't blame it on the companies for increasing their nicotine. There are so many methods out there to help stop smoking that anyone can do it. Whether that person decides to choose to stay on that plan though, is another thing entirely. The point is, it's YOUR choice to stop or keep smoking. It's not easy. It may very well be the hardest thing you ever do in your life. But you have to choose to do that. And if you fall on your face and fail, then you get right back up determined to not let your fall stop you from reaching your destination. What you don't do though, is when you fall start bitching about the companies and placing the blame on them. These companies are doing exactly what their customers want - you buy a cigarette for nicotine, they're giving you more.

I don't need a lecture on quitting smoking, especially from someone who doesn't smoke. I don't need any patronizing comments either.

See above why increasing the nicotine levels without any sort of notification is an issue.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

porn is not physically addictive. There is no chemical that's introduced BY porn, only in response to porn.



this is a mental issue, not a physical one.



I don't need a lecture on quitting smoking, especially from someone who doesn't smoke. I don't need any patronizing comments either.

See above why increasing the nicotine levels without any sort of notification is an issue.

This may come as a surprise to you, but mental addictions can be just as severe as physical addictions.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

I don't need a lecture on quitting smoking, especially from someone who doesn't smoke. I don't need any patronizing comments either.

See above why increasing the nicotine levels without any sort of notification is an issue.

You're the one acting like since we don't smoke, that makes you so much more qualified about speaking on "real addictions."

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

This may come as a surprise to you, but mental addictions can be just as severe as physical addictions.

in terms of overcoming them, I don't believe so.

something like cigs are both mentally and physically addictive. When yo quit smoking, you see it and think, "well they smoke it's not too bad" and even with an adult, rational mind the whole "cool" factor still plays in.

That "cool" factor affects every adult in one way or anoher. Whether it's to dress sharp, have a nice car, nice TV, or whatever. That's one aspect of the mental addiction.

On top of that you have nicotine, which is very strong. Even after a year or two, the addiction remains although it's not very strong. Once you quit smoking, you are fighting the addiction for years and years.

I once quit for 2 years, and I still occasionally had the urge. I quit weed and alcohol a decade ago and never had the urge to resume.. cigs remain as my only vice, even though in my teen years I spent most of my days drunk and stoned.

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

You're the one acting like since we don't smoke, that makes you so much more qualified about speaking on "real addictions."

I'm more qualified to talk about what it's like to be addicted to cigs than you

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

I'm more qualified to talk about what it's like to be addicted to cigs than you

That's fine. But to claim that your addiction is "real addiction" and other addictions that other people face aren't real addictions is a fallacy.

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

That's fine. But to claim that your addiction is "real addiction" and other addictions that other people face aren't real addictions is a fallacy.

You're removing critical words from my argument. I said physical addiction, not just addiction.

[6SpeedTA95]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

You're removing critical words from my argument. I said physical addiction, not just addiction.

caffeine and alcohol are physical addictions

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

You're removing critical words from my argument. I said physical addiction, not just addiction.

Originally Posted by Pro Street

I see a major problem here on LL with people commenting from the sidelines. Expierence addiction... real addiction... then get back to me.

[Pro Street]

Originally Posted by lew

if I say a BMW is a real car, it doesn't mean a Ford isn't a car.


you're debating context now.

[lew]

Originally Posted by Pro Street

if I say a BMW is a real car, it doesn't mean a Ford isn't a car.


you're debating context now.

I'm not debating context. I'm debating what you said and how I took what you said. Now, you may have not meant that, but I took your comments to belittle those with different addictions from you. My bad if that was wrong.